[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Thank you. Good evening, everybody. We have our second Medford Affordable Housing Trust meeting. Tonight's Wednesday, September 4th, 2024. It'll be from 6 to 7.30 p.m. in room 207, second floor, Medford City Hall, 85 George A. Hassell Drive in Medford. This is a hybrid meeting, so you cannot attend by Zoom. I'm gonna call the meeting to order. First up is the attendants. Kayla. Here. Robert. here. Lisa and yeah, carry.
[Moogoor]: It was absolutely not a she said she would join us.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Is it Penny? Right? Yes. Yes, sir. You know, she was amazing. Okay. And myself present. So we have six present one absent as of right now. You may attend a little bit. We have approval of the meeting minutes from the August 7, 2024 meeting. Aditi, if you don't mind providing us an update.
[Moogoor]: Yes. The meeting minutes were updated as of yesterday. Trustee Roberta Cameron had some edits on page 2. Under the allowable uses, there are some edits on the description of the allowable uses and on Page 4, paragraph 2, Trustee Roberta Cameron clarified how CPC has historically voted to reserve more funds for affordable housing. So there was a bit of clarification on that, and that has been updated. Apart from that, the meeting minutes have been the same since I've shared it with the Board of Trustees.
[Penelope Taylor]: Thank you. Is there a motion for approval of the minutes? May I make an edit or is it too late to do so? On page 1, it states, I work in the Office of Housing Stability. The Office of Housing is a different office. I'm standing in the D. Office of Housing Stability. Correct. Okay. Thank you.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Motion for approval with Penny's amendment. Excuse me, I'll make a motion. Second. All those in favor? All those opposed? Six in the affirmative, one absent. Meeting minutes are approved. If one of us is ever on Zoom, then we'll have to be, since we're all present. We have Massachusetts Housing Partnership here to present about Affordable Housing Trust Fund. I would like to invite Shelly Goren, I have to pronounce for her, from MHP to give us a one-on-one training on Affordable Housing Trust Fund. Shelly's been working with the communities and nonprofits to support affordable housing initiative and development. She's been primarily helping communities establish and operate municipal affordable housing trusts. She is one of the state community experts in establishing and utilizing housing trusts and applying Community Preservation Act funds for affordable housing, whether directly or through a housing trust. Thank you, Shelly, for agreeing to provide this training to us. And I'll pass it over to you.
[SPEAKER_08]: Absolutely. Thank you so much. It's nice to be here with you this evening. I'm wondering if I've been given the ability to share yet. Just a minute, Shelly. I'll do that right now.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Great. So tonight, while you share, I'm just going to note that Member Terry Weaver is present, so we have a full committee tonight.
[SPEAKER_08]: Fantastic, congratulations. I hope it happens often. So I'm going to go through some pretty much some basics around affordable housing trust funds. And I of course acknowledge that some of you likely know more than others. And so I don't wanna leave anyone feeling like I'm talking down. I just wanna make sure that I'm not assuming, making any assumptions. I'm gonna pull up some slides here. Okay, can you see the slides?
[Unidentified]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_08]: Okay, great. So I am Shelly Gary and I work with MHP mass housing partnership, and I do work in communities all across the state, helping to establish will pass to accept the affordable housing trust fund statute as well as trying to help trustees get up and running. And for those of you who may not be as familiar with MHP, Mass Housing Partnership, we are a quasi-state agency in Massachusetts that's all about trying to increase the supply of affordable housing and access to affordable housing across the state. We have a few different ways that we work on this mission. We have a Center for Housing Data, so we have a small group of people that are collecting, analyzing, and sharing Data to help inform effective policy. They also have created some really fantastic online tools for communities to use. We have the community assistance team that I'm part of and we work a lot with local communities as well as housing authorities and nonprofit developers to help build local capacity to support affordable housing. the creation and preservation of affordable housing. We have a lending team that's lent over $1.4 billion to create and preserve affordable housing. And then we have a homeownership team that is working diligently to help increase access to homeownership for low and moderate income households across the state. Tonight, we're going to go through start with just some really basics of the housing trust fund statute and then get a little bit into operations and best practices just based on working in a lot of communities across the state. Some of the things that we've learned and then we'll dig into eligible activities, the kinds of things that you can be supporting as an affordable. Housing Trust Fund, and I'm more than happy for you to interrupt me if I'm speaking too fast, if something isn't clear. I will stop after each section and just ask for questions, but feel free for someone to interrupt me if I don't notice, or you can put up your hand and I'll try to notice. But I'm more than happy to be interrupted during this. It doesn't have to be me just speaking for a long time and then talking. So first is just some of the basics, and you likely know this already, but the Municipal Affordable Housing Trust Fund statute is under Mass General Law, Chapter 44, Section 55C. It is your public board. It's a public entity like your other Medford boards. You're created by the local legislative body, your city council. The focus really is fairly narrow. It's to create and preserve affordable housing for low and moderate income households. It's led by a board of trustees that's appointed locally. And because you are a public board, you are subject to public procurement, designer selection, conflict of interest, and public meeting laws, just like all your other municipal boards. Very broadly as a trust, you can address affordable housing needs. You can support local control of housing initiatives and engage in real estate activity. So you can buy and sell real estate or you can help developers buy real estate for affordable housing. You can make timely decisions because unless it's written into your ordinance, you can make decisions without going back to the city council. You can collect money from a variety of sources. So we're seeing communities be more and more creative than what they were even just five or 10 years ago in trying to raise funds for affordable housing and specifically for their trust. The statute is very short and it's not very prescriptive. So again, you want to make sure that you're paying attention to your ordinance to see if you haven't read through it yet, you should read your local ordinance just so that you understand the way that Medford City Council has perhaps added some direction. But the statute just says a minimum of five trustees. It's to include the chief executive officer. It doesn't actually say or an appointee, although some communities interpret that as being allowable. The trustees are appointed by the mayor, and oftentimes this includes the city council in a town. It's the select board, and they're two-year terms. And many communities will stagger these just so that you never have everyone turning over at the same time, which we oftentimes do with other boards of nonprofits. And the trustees are public agents. You're special municipal employees similar to other boards. The statute list 16 explicit powers. Sorry, do you mind if we just interrupt with a question?
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Go ahead. Sorry.
[Roberta Cameron]: So you mentioned that we're special municipal employees. Is that like specifically that we're special municipal employees or just that we're public agents?
[SPEAKER_08]: Public agents, sorry. Oops. Okay.
[Roberta Cameron]: Thank you.
[SPEAKER_08]: Sorry, I maybe spoke wrong.
[Unidentified]: Okay, thank you.
[SPEAKER_08]: So the statute gives 16 explicit powers. These are just some of the big ones of accepting and receiving real property, purchase and retain real or personal property, selling, leasing, exchanging. The statute also allows for additional powers to be given to the trust in line with the statute. And we do have communities that modify the powers so again, you just want to make sure that you're paying attention to your local ordinance in case the city council did. add some restrictions in some communities. It might require a certain percentage of the trustees for certain decisions. Borrowing seems to have some of the most restrictions about how much a trust can borrow or who has some guidance about that. So just make sure that you're paying attention to your ordinance. So those are just some very, very basics. Getting into operations and best practices. So one of the things that we're seeing is that there are more ways that communities are funding their trust today than even just five years ago, five or six years ago. So a variety of different ways. So certainly the Community Preservation Act is one of the most common and about almost 80% of trust communities also have CPA, but it's not a given in every community that The trust receives CPA funds every year, or it's not necessarily a set amount every year. So it's not necessarily a funding source that every community can count on outside of Cambridge and Somerville for the most part. But CPA is a common one. Inclusionary zoning in some communities, the inclusionary zoning bylaw or ordinance directs any in lieu of payments to go to the trust. And in some communities, it's even like in Swampscot, the trust actually determines what the payment is, what the formula is. We have one community in the Cape that has a cell phone tower and the lease payments go to their trust. It's not a lot of money. It's a small amount, but it's something that they can count on each year. We have communities that transfer funds from free cash from the general fund to their trust. So Truro, Brookline are communities that have done that multiple times. We have one community that we know of that has a municipal bond Medfield established their trust and then they voted to allow for a million dollar bond to see the trust and I don't think that they've drawn on it yet I don't think that they've used it but they do have those resources. If they wanted to. Or leans on the Cape has established their trust several years ago now and they also voted for a tax override of $275,000 and they see that as a permanent tax override. They're the only trust that I know of that's been able to access a line of credit at a bank because they do have this consistent funding source. There can be donations to the trust of land or cash. There may be developer negotiated fees. You need to be very careful with how you do this. But we do have a community that received from a friendly 40 B home ownership development. They received funds that then the select board directed to the trust. Some communities are looking at short-term rental fees and using some of these funds for their trust and or affordable housing development. Of course, you likely have heard about real estate transfer fee, the hope of having a real estate transfer fee in the state. And communities are still working towards that, even though it didn't end up in the bond bill this year. And I hear communities talk about taxes for the marijuana. from sales of marijuana, I haven't heard any actually using that at this point. So there are a variety of ways, there could be also a special bylaw or ordinance payments that could be directed to the trust. And I think there are a couple examples of that. So there are a variety of ways that communities are trying to raise additional resources to fund affordable housing. As a new trust starting out, we really encourage you to, I'm sorry, I forgot to look this up. Do you have a current housing production plan? or housing needs than you do. So we would really encourage you to be reviewing this, to be familiar with this. Some of you likely are more than others, but to really understand the identified needs in the community and to be able to really engage in conversations about that and talk with people about that. And to start as a board, to start with those identified needs when you start thinking about setting priorities and what you're going to focus on as a board. You could also create benchmarks you don't have to but Somerville is a community where their trust is actually written into their ordinance that a certain amount of the resources are to go to lowest income households I think it's under 50% of the area median income. So to make sure that they're not just funding at 80% or 100%, but that they are investing in housing for much lower income households. So you could create benchmarks like that. If there was a particular value that was important at a particular time, you don't have to. But we are really encouraging trusts to do some groundwork, to not just jump in, but to really think about what your niche is in the community and how you're going to operate as a board. Another part is just using other resources to familiarize yourself with local housing needs. So this is Datatown, and some of you likely use Datatown, but it's a resource that MHP developed years ago. And there are a lot of different data points for communities all across the state. And so on the left, this is just the housing units by building type in Medford. And you see that you have a housing diversity that's decent, particularly compared to probably I think most other communities in the state, you do have some multifamily housing, which is fantastic. On the right, it just gives you a glimpse of the housing burden in Medford. So the top is renter households and the bottom is home ownership. homeowners, and this is likely in your housing production plan as well, but this is a typical pattern where renters tend to be, there tends to be a greater percentage of renters that are housing cost burdened. The greenish color, the 19.2% are households that are spending at least 30% of their gross income on housing. And then the blue, the 18.9 are households that are severely cost burdened and they're spending at least 50% of their The gross income on housing and then homeowners are are down below. So at this point. Doing a lot of reading and research and just really getting a handle on the housing needs in the community is a is our first suggestion for trust new trust. You can also do a little bit of work learning about affordable housing finance, not to become experts. It's very complicated and it's not your job to be experts, but to have a bit more familiarity because of course, the whole point of having a trust is to help support the creation and preservation of affordable housing. So we have some tools on the housing toolbox, which is another resource that MHP helps to maintain. We have different trainings that have talked through financing affordable housing development, we also have a couple that give the developers perspective of how that a developer puts together an affordable housing deal and the way that local communities can support them. Another thing that I encourage trust to consider is to invite a developer to come 20 year meetings to talk through pro forma with you to help you understand the overall process. Again, not to become experts, but just to be more familiar and more comfortable with the process and to learn about the importance of the role of a local trust and local resources and when developers really need those in order to go to the state for state and federal resources. So Beverly is a community where they invited two developers, a nonprofit, a community development corporation, as well as the local Habitat branch to come and share, go through a pro forma and talk about their process and what it takes for them to put together a housing deal. Winchester recently invited a for-profit developer, A man who had been with a larger developer and he's gone out on his own and he has a lot of experience and he came and talked through a recent development and help the trust just better understand the process and and their role in supporting development. So those are a couple different things that you can be doing to learn a bit more about affordable housing finance. And then once you feel a bit comfortable with, you don't necessarily, this doesn't have to be linear, it can happen at the same time, but once you are feeling fairly comfortable with kind of the needs in the community and you're starting to think about the niche for your board, we really encourage you to create a mission statement if you haven't done this already. to really put out there clearly for yourself, but also for the community of how you see your role in the community. So just to, I'm sure that probably all of you have been involved in mission statements in one way or another and in different boards and organizations over the years, but something succinct and that ultimately talks about what you do, how you do it, and who you do it for. And I just put up Amherst, but There's really what they what strikes me about theirs is that they are kind of reiterating that they're an instrument of local government of town government. And really, their goal is to their mission is to promote identified priorities in the town. So they really wanted kind of collaborative language. And you'll if you haven't already, you can figure out what what makes sense for Medford. And then we're suggesting that trust spend a little bit of time doing some work considering goals and strategies for your board. And really the reason why I've come to this is because I've worked in so many communities over the years and the trust oftentimes will feel pressure to jump in and just do something, to accomplish something. There's oftentimes a lot of external pressure or municipal pressure to do something. It oftentimes leads to, in my opinion, really a paralysis almost, because the housing needs are so great in all of our communities, the resources are really limited. So I'm really encouraging trust to take some time, even if there's external pressure to do something, but take some time to really think through. Given what you know about the needs in the community, given the limited resources that you have, what is your niche and what are two or three key things that you're going to focus on in the next few years? And really pushing trust to make these measurable goals, smart goals, so that there's really a way to measure how you're how you're moving forward. Oftentimes, housing production plans have goals that are really general, very, very broad. It's like increase the supply of senior housing, age-restricted housing, and it's just so big. So I'm really encouraging you to start with your housing production plan, start with what's already been identified, and then from that, really dig into focus on two or three key things and write your goals to be measurable. And then once you have those goals that are measurable, then work on strategies under each of those goals. And then from that, you can really dig into the tasks to be delegating to each other and to be moving things forward. But in some cases, this can be a process that takes a few months or six months. And I'm just really encouraging trust. If that's what it takes, then take that time. It doesn't mean you can't be doing some things at the same time, of course, but I think it's best early on. And then periodically after that to really be thoughtful and very specific about what you're trying to do so that you don't get into the point of spinning your wheels because we all know that the needs are great and the resources are very limited. So I'm just going to give an example of one community. This is itty bitty little well fleet out on Cape Cod and they their trust their new trust decided that their niche really was going to be about development and increasing the supply of new housing affordable housing in town. year-round housing. And so they came up with two goals, two measurable goals. One, create 100 units of low-moderate income rental and home ownership housing units over the next five years. And so Wellfleet is a community that has less than 5,000 residents year-round, so a very small community. So 100 units over five years is actually pretty ambitious for such a tiny little community. And then they are second goal raise $1,000,000 annually for 5 years for $5,000,000. And this is very ambitious for such a tiny community, even though they may be a more affluent community, there's still a very small community. And then under each of those goals, they created specific strategies that they're. Working towards to create to get to their goal. So this is the kind of work that I'm suggesting that trust do and that I'm working with trust on just to hopefully help help trust really focus and to be effective. Another thing that we suggest is that you create guidelines and several trusts have this, but it's in one space putting together a variety of information about the trust and how the trust is going to function. One to help keep you focused, but really so that others and people who may come to you for funds that they can get this information in one place. So the kind of elements that may be in guidelines are mission statement, goals and strategies to put it in. put it there. Roles and responsibilities of the trust, if there's anything just to have a place where you're putting some of the general roles and responsibilities of the trust. Your priority or eligible funding activities, so the things that you really want to focus on funding. Any stipulations for funding, so if you have income limits, If you are only funding housing up to 80% of the area at median income because you want everything to be eligible for the subsidized housing inventory, or if you're going to 100%, if you want developments that are mixed income, if you have a requirement around how long units are affordable, if you have a minimum of 20 years or 30 years or in perpetuity, information about project monitoring and reporting your expectations of what you'll receive from developments that you fund, application process, selection criteria, what you're looking at in an application form, so that someone who wants to come to the trust for funding doesn't have to go in a variety of different places, that they can have one place that they're getting this information, learning about how you operate, and then, of course, this is a document that you want to review periodically and make sure that you keep up to date. And then we suggest early on that you make sure that you're having conversations across boards and possibly even with groups outside of municipal government if that seems appropriate. Just to make sure that you're clarifying rules early on, that you are having some conversation about how boards may work together or entities may work together, perhaps identifying places, ways to collaborate, and maybe even a conversation about who funds what. So what you see in front of you is just an exercise that Manchester by the Sea did within their housing production plan. And you might have something similar, but they created their housing strategies on the left, identified their housing strategies, determined that some are lower, or I'm sorry, shorter term, some are longer term. And then they identified the lead board on the right hand side or the couple lead boards. So, you know, one, it helps a little bit, hopefully, with not stepping on each other's toes, but it also hopefully creates some accountability for who is responsible for different strategies. I think that this kind of an exercise could include a housing authority, depending on your local housing authority. It could include a nonprofit organization that does a lot of housing work. It could look different in different communities, but we've seen in communities that a trust is established and this conversation doesn't happen and there ends up being tension between different boards. If there's a housing partnership or committee, then sometimes there's some tension of just not understanding roles. So we really encourage you to have those conversations early and often just to improve your efficiency in your community and really help to strengthen that kind of the housing infrastructure, your ability as a town, as a city to do housing, making sure that you're working, that you're in communication and not duplicating efforts. And then I just can't say enough to be as transparent as possible. Just don't make it difficult for people to understand what your housing trust is all about, what you're working on, what you're funding, who's involved in the work. So use the webpage to put your information out there, have your ordinance out there, who are the trustees, ways that they can maybe get in touch with you. When you do create goals and strategies put it out on the web page when you invest in different developments promote that. decide what boards, you really need to be in. communication with, regular communication with, and report back. Perhaps sometimes do joint board meetings, if that ever makes sense. And in some communities, they like joint board appointments, which it seems like maybe you have done as well, just to help with communication across boards. And make sure that the communication is in two directions, that if you have someone from a board that they're reporting back to kind of what that board's doing, if it's really relevant, at the same time that they're kind of reporting back to the board that they also sit on. So again, as much transparency as possible. We all know that housing development, particularly affordable housing development can be very controversial. So just don't create vacuums or spaces where people can make stories, fill it in with what they imagine, make it easy for them to find out what you're doing. And it kind of lastly in this section is one thing that you can be working on with other groups such as housing Medford and other boards, the housing authority is really helping to create a culture of support in Medford for affordable housing development. This is an idea that really came out of. someone who is from Amherst, this idea of culture of support and her acknowledging that they have different boards working collaboratively over a lot of years to help create this general, much broader support for affordable housing than many of our communities have. This is a resource that's now maybe seems a little bit dated. It's a little bit oldish, but it's I think it's really still fantastic. And it just is an effort to test housing messages and wondering why so many of them kind of backfire. And they came up with some really, I think, helpful insight. You can just Google. You don't have to live here. It's still out there. But it talks about things like balancing people with places and systems. We want to talk about the people that need affordable housing, but also what are the systems in place that make it difficult for people to access housing in our communities, telling the story of us and not just them, because we all have communities that rely on low and. Kind of middle moderate income jobs and so it's it's not just them it's us it's people in our community that need more affordable housing connecting housing to other social issues we we know with lots of research that. health outcomes improve educational outcomes improve when people have access to safe affordable housing. We know that where you live affects your outcomes and another thing I think can be helpful is to consider the language that you use how you talk about the need in the community and. how you talk about affordable housing. In this particular study, they tested home versus housing, and they found that people thought of housing as public housing. And in the housing world, we know that public housing is critical. It's a critical part of our housing infrastructure. But unfortunately, it has some negative connotations for some people. They also responded to housing as more of a commodity. And with home the word home, they thought more of their family and where they find themselves. So even just the way that with the words that we use can impact how people hear what we're saying. For me, I, I try, even though in the development world, it's. Housing developments are called projects that's just the language and development in the development world but I try really hard not to use projects and communities just because of the housing projects and just how negative that is for people I have people who bring up Cabrini green a very old. Huge development public housing development in in Chicago that's been redeveloped years ago and I still have people in communities and bring this development up as like their core idea of affordable housing so you know I tried to use development housing development or developing homes, instead of. project. So perhaps spending some time of just thinking through how you're going to frame and talk about the need in the community could potentially be helpful. And that could be something that you also do with other entities like, like Housing Medford. So I wanted to pause and just see if there are any thoughts or questions or feedback at this point.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Thank you for the presentation, Charlie. Any questions from the committee? Maybe just one question. You gave examples of ways to fund the trust and who's on the trust. Can you give us an example of how the trust has worked with a developer to build affordable housing in a community in Massachusetts?
[SPEAKER_08]: So I'm actually going to get into a few examples in this next section on that, because we're seeing more trust engage in disposing of affordable housing, for example, I'm sorry, disposing of municipal land for affordable housing. We're seeing more trust engaged in that process. And in some cases where the town is actually transferring land to the trust to dispose of for affordable housing. And then we have many examples of trusts that are contributing funds towards housing development. So we have a lot of examples, so we'll do some of that in this next section.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: I thought the presentation was over, sorry.
[SPEAKER_08]: No, it's okay. No, no, I'm sorry. So now I'm just going to get into the kinds of things that you can be funding and because the Community Preservation Act is one of the key resources that people that trust use to fund housing because you have the Community Preservation Act and because the trust statute came after CPA, so it really was Having CPA and communities and having these resources that had to go to affordable housing that led to, it kind of inspired the Municipal Affordable Housing Trust Fund statute. So I'm going to start with some of the language just because these statutes are so closely tied. So in CPA, you have these verbs acquire, create, preserve, support. and rehab or restore so and then you have the housing on the right hand side so you can use cpa funds to acquire and to create preserve and to support. For rehab and restore, you can use CPA funds if the units were acquired or created with CPA funds. So this becomes a little bit more tricky with housing authorities and existing or existing affordable housing that was not funded with CPA. You cannot use CPA funds to rehab those units. They really have to be units that were created or acquired with CPA. But I start with this kind of frame and then give some examples around that. So this is an example of a housing development in Barnstable that was existing housing. And some of the units had been affordable, but not all of them. And there were, I actually should say that all of these examples were either funded with the CPA or the trust, but they could all be funded by a trust because of the way that these statutes are so closely tied at this point. The trust statute was modified recently. It's actually been several years now, but to allow for all activities under community housing with the CPA statute to be eligible for the trust. So this is an example of acquiring where there were local funds that were contributed to a nonprofit developer, POA, to acquire this development. And now almost all the units are affordable in perpetuity. A few of them remained market rate because there were households that were not income qualified and they didn't want to displace anyone, but it was local funds that were used to acquire existing housing that is now primarily affordable in perpetuity. We have a variety of trusts that have a buy-down program. So it's small-scale homeownership programs that's helping income-qualified households purchase an existing home in town. And they're structured differently, a variety of different ways. In at least one case that I know of, Norfolk, their trust seeks to purchase a few homes each year, modest kind of homes, like the picture that you see here. And then they do any kind of rehab work that's necessary, and then they try to sell them together in a lottery. As housing prices have increased, they struggle to get to do as many of these each year. They've tried to do three a year, and I think that they're down to maybe one or two. But that's one model where the trust actually buys the homes. We have other models where the trust helps to facilitate the sale of a more modest size house to an income qualified household. And then the trust puts in the difference between the agreed upon sale price and what makes it affordable to a household earning 80% of the area median income. And then we have at least one trust where they have vouchers that are worth a certain amount of money, and they will do a lottery for, say, they have $50,000 vouchers, maybe they have $100,000, so they have two vouchers, and then they'll do a lottery to see who is qualified within their income level. They do 100% of the area median income, and then they pick through lottery who gets one of these vouchers and then that household that family has to go out and find the home and around certain parameters of the program. And then they have this voucher that's that's worth up to $50,000. I think it is in out in Leverett. So they're structured really differently, but it's homeownership, their homeownership programs, small scale. They tend to be high subsidy per unit because of the way that they're structured. It's a slow accumulation of units, but it can be a way to help folks access home ownership. It can be a way to preserve some of the more modest size housing in communities. We have some communities where there's teardowns of the smaller, more naturally affordable housing. And so this can be a way to slowly kind of preserve some of those smaller homes in town. We have many examples of communities supporting new construction of trusts as well as CPCs. These are three examples of ones where the community was very engaged. In Norwell, this site had been a police station that was deemed surplus and then actually transferred to the Housing Trust Fund. And they are the ones that put out the request for proposals. And they accepted a proposal by a nonprofit developer, Metro West, who built 18 units of age-restricted housing at this location. Between the trust and the CPC, they contributed about $1.2 million to this development. In Brewster, this is a housing authority site. There was some surplus land that the housing authority owned, and they were working towards building additional housing. The town was actively engaged in seeking a Mass Saves grant to do some infrastructure work to make it doable for this development to happen. And then they put in a local contribution of $550,000. Now they have 30 units of affordable rental housing here, additional rental housing. And then in Westport, this is one that the trust really drove this process and it was it was a long process, but they had a municipal site, they had to acquire an adjacent one to be able to access municipal site. They did additional pre development work and put out a request for proposals and then also contributed towards the development. And now through the community builders, a large nonprofit developer, they have these 50 units of rental housing in Westport. So three developments where the community was really actively engaged in helping to move it forward as well as helping to fund them. We also have quite a few examples of reusing buildings for affordable housing, and sometimes there's a historic component. In Middleborough, this had been a shoe factory, and then a couple of nonprofits were able to work together to redevelop it into 25 units of rental housing. The local contribution was only $25,000. They were a new CPA community at the time, and they just didn't have that many resources, but they put in what they could. In Williamstown, this had been a factory that a developer redeveloped into 42 units of rental housing with a local contribution as well. And then the two on the bottom are schools. So there are quite a few examples of schools being redeveloped into affordable housing. And in both of these cases, and which is oftentimes the case with schools, is that there was an addition built onto the historic part of the building in order to add units to make it more financially feasible. So on the left, Sloan Scott, it's 38 units of age-restricted rental housing. On the right is Auburn, and it's 55 units of age-restricted rental housing. So adaptive reuse, and you may already know this, but oftentimes the reuse of existing buildings is less controversial than new construction. And it can be kind of a win-win for if there's a historic component for people, for those in the community that appreciate historic preservation. So it can help. It can help a development in some cases. And then preserve. In the CPA statute, we do see some communities trying to put a lot of stuff under preserve, but preserve, the definition in CPA is actually a pretty high bar. It's the protection of personal or real property from injury, harm, or destruction. It's not rehab. It's not just putting in new sinks or countertops. It really is much greater than that. It's protecting the units from not being habitable or losing their affordability restriction. There was a memo that was put out by DHCD, now EOHLC, that helped articulate this to housing authorities of what would qualify for preserve, what would really be rehab and what would be maintenance. So CPA funds are never allowed for maintenance. And if you are not familiar with this, you might want to be familiar with this and I can send it over just so you can read through a little bit. But when we talk about preserve affordable housing, we are oftentimes talking about the affordability restriction. Many restrictions are set to expire. And so there are trusts as well as CPCs that are engaged in extending affordability on units to keep them affordable for a longer period of time or in perpetuity if you're using CPA funds. This is an example in Amherst. So this was not a trust, this was not the trust driven, this was CPA because they bonded. But this was a development in, it's a development in Amherst that has 41 units that are affordable. They were set to expire. They only had 15 year restrictions. It was a financing product, I think, with mass housing and the owner at the time was not interested in extending the affordability. The community was very concerned about losing these units. They reached out to MHP and a plan was brought up to reach out to. Ugh, I'm forgetting the developer offhand. A large developer that has experience in low-income housing tax credits in 40B and Beacon communities reached out to Beacon. Beacon actually negotiated with the owner at the time to buy the development. And then the community decided to bond $1.25 million of CPA funds so that these 41 units are now affordable in perpetuity. So some trusts are paying attention to affordability restrictions that are set to expire, and they're a part of the conversation. And sometimes that's working with the CPC or with the planning department. But there are some trusts where they're paying attention to that. So it's something you could consider if that seems an appropriate role for the trust. Yes. And also with reserve. Yes, go ahead. One question about that.
[SPEAKER_03]: Does the municipal entity get a notice when affordability restriction is going to expire?
[SPEAKER_08]: So there is a list that CDAC manages that you could, I'll send that to you. So there is a list that does have some of that information. And it's something also just with your local monitoring of affordable housing that you should If Medford, you might already have someone that's doing that. Yeah, because of the community of your size that typically there's someone is already kind of paying attention to that. So it should be available readily available to you. Yes. Great, thank you. Yep, so with preserve also part of what comes out of protecting from harm is work around kind of the envelope of the building. So this is an example in Gloucester where they had a unit that was already shuttered in this building because of leaking, the roof was leaking and you need to get down. And they used Some CPA funds, so they requested some CPA funds to supplement state modernization formula funding in order to replace the roof. So because other units were at risk of no longer being habitable, they used some CPA funds under preserve along with these other state funds to replace the roof. So this is an example of what could qualify under preserve with existing housing that wasn't created or acquired with CPA funds. And then under support, there are a variety of activities that have been seen as allowable. And so this is the same for the trusts. So pre-development work, if you have a municipal site that you're interested in seeing used for affordable housing, you could potentially use some trust resources to do some pre-development work and to help put together a request for proposals. You could potentially use trust resources to update your housing plans and rental assistance is explicitly allowed in the CPA statute. And so that's also something that the trust could be engaged in. And during the pandemic, it was actually the housing trust in several communities that were the ones that really instigated and that funded emergency rent assistance. So we've seen several communities, several trusts engaged in that kind of work.
[Roberta Cameron]: It may take some time to talk more about types of plans that can be included in support, or should we take some time later after the presentation to talk about that?
[SPEAKER_08]: You're asking me? Yeah. You mean what could fit under housing plans?
[Unidentified]: Yes.
[Roberta Cameron]: Should we take some time later to talk about it or pause for a moment to talk about examples of what we might consider for our support for housing plans here?
[SPEAKER_08]: So I mean, what we've seen in the past is that sometimes the trust resources are used to update the housing production plan, for example, or to do a housing needs analysis. So it's really in line with kind of what we've seen as kind of more of the standard kind of plans that communities start with.
[Roberta Cameron]: A question that came up specifically for us is whether it could be used for, say, a nexus study or a linkage study to help generate another source of income for the trust.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, I have had communities ask about that. So I would just go back to the purpose of the trust, which is to create or preserve affordable housing for low and moderate income households. And I mean, you could make arguments otherwise, like is a housing production plan necessarily doing that? I mean, it's to lead to that.
[Roberta Cameron]: So a step further then is whether CPA funds, specifically if CPA funds are what are going to be housing trust, can CPA funds be used for that purpose?
[SPEAKER_08]: No, I don't think the CPA funds could be used for that, no. If you had other resources, you maybe could consider that, because if it's, I mean, I think it's still really a stretch, is what I'm sure that I've told other communities. So I'd rather kind of think it through offline a little bit and not, if you're recording this and all that, like, I don't want to kind of misspeak, I want to be more thoughtful. But I definitely don't think that CPA funds could be used for anything studying linkage. No, because that's not at all in line with what CPA is. And it's not about researching funding a trust like that, that's not, no. If you have other resources, you know, like we can maybe think it through a little bit or I would just wanna kind of put out some questions for you to think through. None of us are the trust police and so, you know, it's implemented locally. So I would just wanna like put out kind of questions or things to think about and then you would work through it yourself. But I'm happy to do more of that kind of offline a little bit.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: And while you're thinking about it offline, Shelly, it would be $80,000 to do a nexus study to add a portable housing component to our linkage fees. So developers would be paying into parks and open space, public safety, and we would like to do a nexus study so they start paying into a fourth bucket, which would be towards affordable housing. Offline link through it because I've made a connection.
[Roberta Cameron]: Okay. Can I just add a follow up question? My understanding with CPA funds was. For support, it had to support the creation of a new of affordable. Yeah, it's my understanding that CPA is either related to housing units or to households. So it was my instinct also that that would be a no for the NEXUS study, but I knew that the question was in the air, so I just wanted to make sure that we covered it.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yeah. I would just say definitely not for a NEXUS study with CPA funds.
[Penelope Taylor]: Yeah, I think Shelley, if you do have questions to kick back to us to consider around the research area, I'd be super interested in that to help think through what it could apply to or not. So yeah, very interested if you could share that.
[SPEAKER_08]: Yep, I will put that in the email, just kind of some of the questions that I would suggest that you think through. Thank you. Yep. So I'm just going to wrap up here that just kind of some final thoughts is to that we're really suggest that trust, especially new trust that you really consider your local infrastructure that you kind of look at the lay of the land, the needs and the resources and think through what is your niche, so that you're not duplicating, you're not stepping on any toes and really articulate your role in the community, develop goals that reflect identified needs. So that's why we really say, start with the data. I know that data doesn't convince everyone, but we really strongly urge that you start with that and that you are investing your resources with a reflection of the needs that have been identified in the community. So often, boards will be tempted to do kind of take the path of least resistance that is not necessarily a reflection of the true need or the real need in the community. It might be hearsay or might be what certain influential people want, but that's not necessarily a reflection of needs. So we really suggest that you start with identified needs and that you be real about your capacity, honest about what you can do. You're a volunteer board, you have limited resources, and that gets back to why I really suggest two or three goals at a time. just to make sure that you can do a few things well instead of being really frustrated with having a hard time doing anything because you have really high expectations for yourself or too high of expectations. So be real about your capacity. And then there are a lot of different resources. MHP has a bunch of online resources that we've put together here. and we want to be a resource for you. So I, as well as my colleagues, are here to help answer questions, or I have some that have experience that I don't have, technical experience that I don't have, and we're here to help you move housing forward in your community. So don't be shy. Are there other questions or thoughts or comments that anyone wants to share?
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: That was very thorough and thank you so much for the presentation and being with us on a Wednesday night and giving us your time. Are there any questions from the committee? Thank you so much.
[SPEAKER_08]: Thank you.
[Roberta Cameron]: Thank you so much.
[SPEAKER_08]: Nice to see you.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: The main officers, we have volunteers to serve as chair, vice chair, and treasurer. We have two volunteers for chair, Lisa Ann and Penny. We have three for vice chair, Kayla, Lisa Ann, and Penny. And for treasurer, we have Carrie. Thank you all for volunteering.
[MCM00001729_SPEAKER_03]: Is there a nomination for the treasurer? Carrie? I will admit, I've never done the treasury, so I will need to, but I just said I wanted help to get more involved.
[Moogoor]: Thank you. Yeah, the city's treasurer is going to manage the funds, and you will just communicate that? Yeah, definitely.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Yeah, you may be able to sign here. to nominate Carrie as treasurer. It's seconded by... I think you do not have to. Oh, Roberta. Penny and Roberta with the nominations. All those in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye. All those opposed? Carrie, thank you. Congratulations, you are our treasurer. I'll go with the chair first, because there are two... two people that volunteered. I think Roberta and I did too, but nobody else did. So we did not volunteer for anything. We said we'd do it, but I didn't want to be, one election every two years isn't good for me. Lisa Ann Davidson and Penny, and then we vote for vice chair too. And then just so everybody knows, we have Kayla, thank you so much for volunteering to work on the Declaration of Trust. And for the action plan, Roberta, Kayla, Penny, and Lisa-Ann, and we can only do up to three. So I know probably want to spread the love. So that's the full picture. We'll go through the chair first. We have Lisa-Ann and Penny.
[Roberta Cameron]: So we chatted, either one. Oh, easygoing. It's one of those things, though. I put my name in for either one, just not knowing who was going to be there. I'm happy to serve as the chair, but tell me what you want to know, and we'll work from there.
[Penelope Taylor]: I would nominate you to be the chair. But I'll do the same way. I don't know. That's a great idea. Let's try nominating. I nominate Lisa Ann.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Is there a second? Second. Thank you. All those in favor? We got a 7-0 vote. So congratulations, Lisa Ann. You are our chair. Congratulations. Thank you. And for vice-chair, we have Kayla and Penny.
[SPEAKER_03]: I think with maybe the declaration of trust in my court, officially, I can.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Thank you. Thank you. Penny, seconded by Lisa Ann. All those in favor? Aye. All those opposed? Thank you so much, Penny, for stepping up. You are our vice chair. Congratulations. Thank you. And like I said, the next item agenda up is to establish working groups. We have our first working group, which is the Declaration of Trust. Kayla, thank you so much for volunteering to participate in drafting our Declaration of Trust. Would anybody like to join this group? review what's written.
[SPEAKER_03]: I could help. I don't know how much.
[Moogoor]: I think it depends on the community, but roughly maybe 10 pages or less. That's, yeah. But we have exactly what happens from the neighboring communities and we can work on that. And KP Law, our legal counsel will definitely review it.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Yes. Thank you. I'm also happy to review and ask a lot of questions. Okay.
[Unidentified]: In the next meeting, we'll share the draft so everybody can provide comments.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Great, thank you.
[Moogoor]: And working group number two is the trust action plan.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: 4 volunteers can only have up to 3.
[MCM00001763_SPEAKER_00]: So I do have a question about that working group if that's okay. So in what way does the action plan kind of incorporate what MHP just talked about in terms of 2 or 3 goals and reviewing the housing production plan? Is that part of the action plan or is the action plan like 1 of those? items.
[Moogoor]: It's part of the action plan where the working group will review the housing production plan and then identify goals that would align with the housing production plan and then probably identify measurable goals like MHCs have to stay in one place.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: And setting up a trust is a goal, right?
[Moogoor]: The declaration of trust? No, the establishing.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Yes. That would be a goal of ours. Yes. To establish what we just learned about.
[Moogoor]: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. And drafting a mission statement.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Yeah. Since you're drafting a declaration to trust you want to be involved in both.
[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe I'll start with just declaration. I'll put you on the spot.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Because that would be the only thing Roberta is doing as far as these two sections. So it would be Roberta, Penny, and Lisanne. And will she just support those three? All in favor? Okay. Thank you, everybody, for volunteering. We can discuss the meeting schedule for group one and group two. How often would the working groups prefer to meet in a month? The working groups can be virtually in person based on the members availability and flexibility.
[Moogoor]: Yes, Kayla and I can discuss and based on your introductory, we can meet before the next meeting. Yeah. And the working group, second working group, would you feel comfortable to coordinate between the members? How often would you like to meet?
[Roberta Cameron]: Um, that's hard to say. Probably we need, um, to me, I mean, at least once to start off and then probably, um, like once a month or every couple of weeks would be sufficient because there's going to be some like drafting on our own and then bringing that together with the group. So, I'm hearing I just want to make sure I'm hearing correctly. Yeah. More than less than 1, it's it depends how quickly we want to have this drafted. So, like, there's probably a finite number of. Meetings that we need to have to draft the plan. So, are we getting that work done in a short span of time? Or are we going to take a few months to get that work done? That's that's really the. So, does it make sense if we meet during the month of September and come back in October with a plan of how long because it gives us time to kind of wrap our heads around it look at schedules.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes,
[Roberta Cameron]: Um, how long would, how quickly would we like to have an action plan? Like, what, what is our goal for having an action plan completed?
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Everybody probably has full-time jobs, so we can't do as long as it doesn't take.
[Roberta Cameron]: Well, is there a solution that we need to like work backwards from to have it completed? I think that's something that we can, it would be I wouldn't want to put a time frame on it right now, only again, because of all of our different schedules that we have here. But what Shelly was saying is take our time and really think it through. And I'm somebody, I like to have what we're going to do and then start breaking down the steps and then see how long it's going to take to do it that way. I don't want to set us up with something that we're not going to be able to move. Right.
[Penelope Taylor]: And I just wanted to clarify, the action plan includes both the mission statement and our goals, correct? So I think there are some things that might come before other things, which I think we can talk about in our meeting and present the group as like a whole goal.
[Roberta Cameron]: And then digesting the plan that we already have, the production plan that's there, and how can we make it down and break it down into doable steps with one or two years exactly what shall it show and nothing unattainable.
[Moogoor]: Some communities, those who have drafted the action plan have approached the community and involved them in drafting the action plans that has taken much longer. And some communities have chosen not to have a stakeholder engagement or community engagement as well.
[Unidentified]: Yeah.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Next up, we have our CPA application. That's due very soon, so we need to finalize that. I'm going to turn it over to Aditi to provide us an overview of your application.
[Moogoor]: So in big picture way, we have four projects. Like Shelly mentioned, they are developments and not projects, to clarify. So the first one is to develop affordable housing on city or not. I just want to know your thoughts. So there are two scenarios. Scenario one, where we could approach mass housing. They have a grant program called Planning for Housing Production Grant. And I did have a meeting with them last Friday to check if Medford is eligible, because on their website they said that only gateway cities could apply. Medford is eligible to apply and they accept applications on a rolling basis. And when the trust is ready to apply, we can go ahead and apply. So they have funded projects through technical assistance. And the cost of the projects have been $50,000 to $100,000 based on the scale of the affordable housing development. And that would require a 10% local match. So if we apply for CPA funds to have a local match, that would be helpful. And scenario two is if we are successful in getting the grant, then we would probably have to rely on CPA funds. And again, that would be roughly between $50,000 to $100,000 per project. Any thoughts on that?
[Roberta Cameron]: So I just wanna make sure that I, and I'm sorry, it takes me a little bit to process, so I wanna make sure that I'm understanding. Scenario one is to, with the help of, housing, thank you, to be able to acquire, to be able to develop land on already city-owned land, develop housing, city-owned land.
[Moogoor]: to acquire technical assistance so they can help walk us through the whole process to assess the city on lots and then do pre-development work and then draft an RFP. Yes. Thank you. And then project two is support construction of new affordable housing. This is a very general proposal, but if you have any further thoughts on this, then we could include that, but this is just hoping that in the pipeline we have these projects. And then project three is to build a farm to purchase land where it becomes available. And then the fourth one, down payment assistance. I think Lisa proposed this, but just to clarify, North Suburban Consortium that we are part of has a down payment assistance program. And they have funded up to five Medford residents in the last five years. And they provide, I'm just trying to see what's the amount that they provide, up to $10,000. Yes, and Roberta had some comments on this.
[Roberta Cameron]: Yeah, I'm not sure that CPA funds can be used for that type of down payment assistance, but the example that Shelly gave earlier of a buy-down program, CPA could be used for a buy-down program. But I just had up a level, a thought about what we've just looked through on the application. Perhaps instead of project, you could frame it as example. And these are examples of the types of projects that we might do, because we haven't developed a plan yet. We don't actually know how we want to use the funds. But you could frame it that these are examples. drawn from the housing production plan and that these are potential ways that we might use the funds and that we'll be developing a plan that will guide us which we will provide the committee with with the TPC before using the funds.
[SPEAKER_03]: So would down payment
[MCM00001763_SPEAKER_00]: Do you not have the voucher program to provide down payment or is the North Suburban Consortium doing very specific?
[Roberta Cameron]: So what would be required for CPA is that we would give the funding in exchange for a long-term deed restriction. So that $5,000, $10,000 down payment assistance is just a gift without any requirement in return. There has to be a quid pro quo for CPA funding. We have to be acquiring the deed restriction for it to be eligible. But it doesn't, the deed restriction doesn't necessarily have to be in perpetuity. You could do a long term. So you can do a 25, a 20 year deed restriction and it doesn't have to be how I read that, that that's the North, the NSCs, like when I proposed it, I was thinking something bigger than what NSC does, because A, you're gonna give it to Medford residents only, purchasing in the city of Medford, NSC caps the income at 80% of AMI, CPA allows you to go up to 100% of AMI, and people who are making a moderate, which is 81 and up, they still are finding it difficult to purchase. So why not make that funding available for higher income households? It's just giving more, and it will definitely need to be for 20 years, 10,000 division needs to do a little bit more than that. But I also felt that if we're going to put in the application an example of down payment assistance, that we should also put in the application an example of rental assistance. I thought about doing the rental, asking about rental assistance, but it sounds like the CPC is already doing rental assistance. And there are an idea when I was thinking about it, you know, I'm thinking about what The city of some of what I'm used to working with, and they do do 2 years worth of rental assistance. They do prevention. They do all of this. I figured that that would continue through the CPC and sometimes. Well, there's a question whether, you know, like, that's a question about the future. Since we didn't have an affordable housing trust, the organizations applied directly to the CPC for that money. But maybe Medford will evolve to something closer to what Somerville does, where all of the housing assistance goes through the affordable housing trust and not the CPC. So we might or might not change in that direction. So I would maybe as an example, like this is why we need to develop the plan. So I'd include it as an example, but that's not necessarily what we're going to do.
[Moogoor]: So regarding dental assistance program, do I include some language on that based on the current dental assistance program that is funded by CPC? So these are some of the, yeah, go ahead.
[Theresa Dupont]: Yeah, I was just gonna say, I can share with you that language so we can connect with that.
[Moogoor]: Thank you. Are there any other examples that you would like to include apart from private fees? And Roberta had some comments on question three, so I'm going to update it. We have to identify the appropriate CPA allowable uses. So example one, which is to build affordable housing on secure lots would be under create and not support. example two is create, but example three would be under acquire, that's acquiring property or purchasing land through CPA funds. And then example four, down payment assistance would be under support. And example five or fifth one would be, that's rental assistance would also be under support.
[Penelope Taylor]: Okay.
[Moogoor]: Yeah. I'll just go over this, but if you have any comments, please feel free to talk to me. We are asking for $250,000. And some background information of some of the potential funding sources that we would explore. One is the mass housing grant. And the second one is we're looking at affordable housing linkage. We still don't identify funds. And this third one is a developer that's developing housing developments. The MDDC, that's the Mystic Valley Development Commission, has agreed to contribute $250,000 to the but we are yet to record the agreement and hopefully we'll have that coming soon. Then other potential fund resources is something that the trust will explore.
[Penelope Taylor]: Yeah, there's a typo under applicant on the page you just got to page 11. No, I saw it like last night. Go back to the one you just clicked to. I mean, go forward, I guess. Go forward one more. Sorry. No, all the way to where we were. Yep, where the budget page. Yeah, so an applicant, affordable has the double A at the beginning on the top right. Okay. A lot of time.
[MCM00001763_SPEAKER_00]: Thank you. I'm wondering for other things that we're applying for financial support. Do we ever put in any like sustainability grant applications that would be used for affordable housing? So maybe like decarbonization projects for any of the housing units or like new roof and then also put solar on it. Is that something that we do? And if so, do we call it out here that it's like a synergy pot of money we have?
[Roberta Cameron]: That's a great thing to put in our plan, but it might be premature to put it in this application. Gotcha.
[MCM00001763_SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just didn't know if we had existing other funds that we're thinking about or other grants that we already have, but we haven't considered.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Solar ordinance. I can't think of any other grants.
[Moogoor]: I should check with our climate planner if there are other grants. Are there any comments on the budget? This is just tentative. Hopefully it will change. And then we require a letter from the mayor.
[Unidentified]: Yeah.
[Moogoor]: So the application deadline is next week on Monday. So update it based on your comments and then share that with you before I submit it.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Thank you so much.
[Moogoor]: I'd like to clarify Penny's question. If a municipal employee can serve as a treasurer, the KP law has clarified that. You could, if you're employed in another city. Yes. Thank you.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: Great meeting. That's all that is on our agenda. So I appreciate you being here and the work ahead. I appreciate all the committees and Kayla. Okay, I see a lot of other items or just on the agenda.
[Penelope Taylor]: You can call, you can talk to the DP myself. Yeah, I just can't talk to more than the forum to make sense of something else.
[Breanna Lungo-Koehn]: The meetings, and if you have one in a gender item, you can reach out to. So is there a motion to adjourn? Thank you. Secretary, can you drop me? All those in favor? Opposed? Thank you. Meeting is adjourned. Do we have a date? It's on October 2nd at 6 p.m. This is the first Wednesday that we'll be having a meeting.
[Unidentified]: Thank you. Thank you.
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