[Denis MacDougall]: On February 12th, 2020, Governor Baker signed into law a supplement to COVID-19 fiscal appropriations and an extension through July 15th, 2022 of certain authorizations related to public meetings. This new law extends the remote meeting provisions of the Governor's March 12th, 2020 executive order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law. In accordance with the 2020 executive order, this meeting of the City Metro Bicycling Advisory Commission is being conducted totally via remote participation using Zoom, including committee members and the public. The use of Zoom complies with the laws requirements to provide live, adequate, alternative means of public access to the deliberations of the public body, instead of holding meetings in a public place that is open and physically accessible to the public. Persons who would like to listen to or view this meeting while in progress may do so by using the link that was included on the meeting agenda posted on the City of Medford website. If, despite our best efforts, we are not able to provide real-time access, we will post a record of this meeting on the City's website in the near future at the link provided in the meeting agenda.
[Emily O'Brien]: Okay, thank you. So this meeting of the May 25th meeting of the Medford Bicycle Advisory Commission will come to order. Secretary, would you please call the roll?
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Jared Powell.
[Emily O'Brien]: He is not here.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Pat Bivens. Here. Lisa Duraco. Okay, not here. She's here. Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, thank you. Sorry, I'm trying to figure out. Bruce correct.
[Emily O'Brien]: No, I don't see him.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: No. Emily O'Brien.
[Emily O'Brien]: I'm here.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Bidan Fairchild.
[Emily O'Brien]: Here.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Ernie Moynihan, sorry. Ernie Moynihan.
[Ernie Meunier]: Moynihan is good.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Moynihan, sorry.
[Ernie Meunier]: He's obviously present.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Doug Packer.
[Unidentified]: I am here.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Sorry, can't catch up. Peter Kautz. He's here, but he's muted. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here.
[SPEAKER_13]: I'm here.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here. I'm here And I believe we have a few guests tonight. Would anyone like to introduce themselves? Anyone? I see Denny Freezer.
[Emily O'Brien]: Denny Freezer or I think I saw Amy is here.
[SPEAKER_14]: Hey there, this is Amy from the city of Medford.
[Emily O'Brien]: Denny Freezer, if you'd like to introduce yourself. If you have trouble with your camera or your microphone and you can't, you can type into the chat and introduce yourself there.
[SPEAKER_00]: Hi, can everybody hear me? I just unmuted myself.
[Unidentified]: Yes.
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm brand new to Medford. I haven't even moved in yet, but I saw that you had a meeting and I wanted to watch what's going on. I'm a lifelong cyclist, so I'll just keep quiet and watch tonight.
[Emily O'Brien]: Awesome, welcome.
[Ernie Meunier]: Welcome.
[Emily O'Brien]: Great, so we have a few announcements. Most of these should be fairly brief. The first is that there is a message from Amber Christopherson that was really short notice, but she's of Mystic River Watershed Association. They're exploring the idea of creating a shared use path from High Street up to Mystic Valley Parkway to the Tri-Community Greenway. We've discussed that previously. They have gotten the go ahead from DCR to apply for a mass trails grant for a feasibility study, and they wanted a letter of support on behalf of MBAC. So I took the action of sending that letter of support on our behalf. The timeline was pretty short, and I don't think anybody is going to complain about that. Next thing is the Office of Planning, Development and Sustainability has a website, and it would be really nice if there was a little more information on that website about to get around in Medford without using your car or with using your car a little less. And I met a little while ago with Ellery Klein from Walk Medford and Gaston Fiore in doing double duty and discussed a number of things that can be added to that website. For starters, we'll just have some really basic information about the mechanics of finding a good bike route and how to follow a bike route that you have saved on your phone in some way. Some of the places you might go looking for good bike routes. Nothing too complicated, but I think this is also a good opportunity to think about if there's more in-depth information we might want to add to our own website, including maybe more maps or more in-depth information about other stuff, about just getting around by bike in Medford or using a bike as a multimodal method in combination with blue bikes when we eventually get them, or in combination with using your own bike, etc. So just something to think about, even if not all of the gory details go on the website of the Office of Planning, Development and Sustainability, if we have a lot more in-depth information that we want to add to over time, then linking to the Medford Bikes website would be a good way to tie into that. So that's an effort that's ongoing and I will update you when there's more information. Are there any other updates or announcements?
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: One thing I should probably request is just that we do an approval of the minutes.
[Emily O'Brien]: You're right, and I missed that. Do we have a... Has everybody looked at the minutes?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, before you motion, I made a couple of edits about an hour ago, just to the dates on the Clippership Connector and the League of American Bicyclists certification.
[Emily O'Brien]: Does anybody have any other additions or comments? Do we have a motion to approve the minutes?
[Ernie Meunier]: Seconded.
[Emily O'Brien]: All in favor?
[Emily O'Brien]: All opposed? Minutes are approved. Do we have any other announcements?
[Ernie Meunier]: Emily? Yeah, can I just say, do we need to announce that we have a quorum? Just for formality, I forget whether we do that each month.
[Emily O'Brien]: It doesn't hurt to point out that we definitely do have a quorum. We did the roll call, and we were not missing very many. So I think we're covered. Are there other announcements before we go on? Good. So the next thing on the agenda is that the Salem is the Salem street bike lanes that were approved by the traffic commission recently. Um, Amy, if you are here and would you like to say anything about that? Um, go ahead.
[SPEAKER_14]: Sure. I can. Um, unfortunately my remote connection isn't working. Uh, I'm at home right now. Um, so I don't have, uh, the plans to show you right now, but I hopefully Todd is going to be able to do that. He's on his way home. he's going to try to log in and email it to me. So I apologize for that. But I kind of wanted to get, since I wasn't able to come to the traffic commission meeting, I didn't hear firsthand one of the comments that you guys had. So I wanted to hear it straight from you. Like if you can recall just at the end, basically the termination of the project on the East side, there's like the bus stop and you're approaching to the Fellsway. Yeah, I just wanted to hear what you guys, what you thought and what you would prefer, I guess.
[Emily O'Brien]: Should we, if Todd is going to join, I think we did send the plans around to the email list. So I think we have basically had a chance to see it, but do we want to wait on that until Todd is here or we can have the document up on the screen? Yeah, I guess so, yeah. I mean, I can kind of remember what was discussed, but it would be, or I can run and pull it up for myself.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so I actually, I should say that I do have a, I took a stab at what I think might help solve the problem that I think you guys were having, but again, since I didn't hear it straight from you guys, I wanted to just Talk through it with you for a second.
[Emily O'Brien]: What I remember was the concern was how the bike lane ends and what the merge area looks like. And that it ends at a, and then the lane markings, there was some confusion because they're drawn onto the plans, but those are not, like the left straight and the right turn lanes, those are not part of the project. So there was some confusion about how it, interfaces with those that are not actually going to necessarily be there. I remember one point was when the bike lane basically shares space with the bus stop. I know it's common to paint the bike lane on the right-hand half of the bus stop and the left-hand half of the bus stop becomes a buffer. I think it's preferable to swap those, so put the bike lane painted on the left-hand side of the bus stop. The reason being that shortly after that, the bike lane ends, so cyclists then have to merge into the regular flow of traffic. Not to mention that I always think it looks a little awkward to paint a bike lane on the right-hand side of the bus stop, because then it encourages people to be on the right-hand side of a bus that's going to be letting passengers on and off. And that was one comment. And then also just how that interfaced with the turn lanes after that. But I think there was some confusion about whether those turn lanes are actually really there.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so because the Bellsway is a DCR road, we would have to go through a process with them in order to strike those lanes that way, or add anything to the approach. And that was, yeah, a mistake not supposed to be included in the package that was sent out. So that was our bad. But as far as the bus stop is concerned, excuse me, maybe it's confusing. So I've been using, I don't know, a standard that I pulled from VTD from the City of Boston Transportation Department. And actually it's not so much putting the bike lane on the right side, it's actually just the bike lane and the bus stop are the same space for that stretch for the length of the bus stop. That's something they've been using and it's one of their standard details. But if it's confusing, like that's obviously it's not our standard, so we don't necessarily have to use it if you all find it confusing. I think it is a new standard of theirs, so it might be PB, Lisa Smith-Miyazaki, she-her, hers.
[Emily O'Brien]: like to the left of parked cars, and then the bus stop takes up an area that doesn't have any parked cars, then the bike lane moves against the curb during that area instead of just continuing in a straight line. And that to me encourages, you know, if somebody is just following the bike lane as painted, they're much more likely to be in between that bus and that curb. And there's, and, you know, of course, you don't have to be, you don't have to do what the paint says, but it seems like it encourages people to be in the wrong place when a bus is letting off passengers. And it is what they do in other places. And I've seen that before. It doesn't look like it makes sense to me. Maybe there's another logic to why they do it that way. I suspect it's just because people think, oh, the bike lane needs to always be as far to the right as possible. And if there's room for a buffer between the bike lane and traffic, then it should be there. And that's not a bad way to think about it, except that in this case, I think it just encourages if it encourages people to do anything it encourages people to do the wrong thing.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: I think there's also. There's a little bit of variation and I'm not quite sure what the standard that we're talking about says in terms of how the bike lane enters the shared stop, because you can have, if the bike lane is like coming up to the bus stop, which is wider than the bike lane, it can either go up to the far right edge of the bus stop, or it can, you know, line up with the left edge. just, you know, not in terms of the markings within the bus stop, but the markings up to the bus stop and after the bus stop. And that can make a difference.
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah, I think that's, that's kind of what we're. Yeah. Okay, Ernie.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Gotcha.
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah. In addition to the displeasure of being right hooked by a bus. Once we get critical mass of bike riders attempting to pass a bus on the right, it will become an incredible imperilment of discharged passengers, especially elder elderly or those in physical need to be having to look for bicycles coming as they exit a bus. I mean, that's a nightmare. And I agree with Emily there. We're just not seeing it yet because the numbers don't support that kind of hazard awareness. But yeah, we've got to keep the bikes in the left side of the bus and just engineer, if necessary, a successful and slow enough and carefully marked enough scissor intersection so that those lanes can interchange as necessary.
[Emily O'Brien]: Well, I think even if we can't, like if the bus stop overlaps with the bike lane, that's a common thing around here. But the bike lane doesn't need to change direction and go swerve up against the curb in that spot. It can just stay in a straight line, which effectively means that the bike lane aligns with the left edge of the bus stop, not with the right edge. And they do tend to paint it to align with the curb instead. And that's what I think is more likely to indicate to people that they should be on that right edge. And that's more likely that they're going to be in the way of passengers getting on and off. And I don't know why they don't just, you can just paint the bike lane going straight. And like, you know, like it, like Bidan said, this is just about what you do, how it interfaces with that bus stop.
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah, we don't want to see signs on buses saying watch out for bicyclists as you exit.
[Emily O'Brien]: I mean, that would be, I mean, we're in this case, we're also talking about right after this, the bike lane ends. Who's this?
[SPEAKER_14]: I don't know. Sounds like someone's TV.
[Emily O'Brien]: We are also right after this spot, the bike lane ends entirely. So we also need to think about how that termination looks visually. A lot of times when they have kind of the angle dotted line that angles off to the right at the end of a bike lane, We know that the dotted line means that the bicyclists are going to cross the dotted line and be in the travel lane. But what it visually looks like is that the bicyclists shrink down to being six inches wide and they turn into riding on the fog line or something. And I think there are other ways that make it look like two streams of traffic are merging rather than like some people that used to be on your right-hand side are now disappearing. At least can we get sheriffs there?
[SPEAKER_13]: Not enough. I agree, but it's, you know, it's better than just having the bike lane disappear.
[Emily O'Brien]: Well, some things that we, I think we also discussed are like having the, the bike lane turns into kind of a, like blocks that then lead into the middle of the travel lane and then it disappears. So then it's really clear that there's something directing people that direction. And then it just is clear to everybody involved that two streams of traffic have to merge, not that one of them just goes away.
[SPEAKER_14]: Does that make sense?
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: The other comment that I had at the track commission meeting was that if there's room for it. it would be really good to have a striped zone between the parking lane and the bike lane to be the door zone, basically, so that we encourage people to ride far enough away from parked cars that are not going to get doored, because that's a significant danger on a street with heavy traffic and heavy truck traffic and bus traffic.
[Emily O'Brien]: And if the bike lane can be six feet wide, then it could also be five feet wide with a one foot buffer between the bike lane and the parked cars. Yeah. Which doesn't take away any more space, but it does indicate, hey, you know, don't be right there.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Right.
[SPEAKER_14]: Gotcha, okay. It looks like, actually, I did find the, The version that we talked about a traffic commission in an email and I'm looking at it and looks like for most of the way. We will be able to put a small buffer. Excuse me, next to the park cars. Yeah.
[Ernie Meunier]: Amy, I forget if there was delineation of spaces where we would use green fields to emphasize bicycle. He is what a greenfield paint better paint permanent, you know,
[SPEAKER_13]: Like along Beacon Street in Somerville.
[SPEAKER_14]: The green conflict zones?
[SPEAKER_13]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. That is not something that I think that we have in-house now, but we definitely know that that's a need and we want to do that in the future. Because this is an in-house project, we need to work with stuff that we have, but we might be able to get some. I don't know. I think I see Todd on here. Do you want to weigh in on that?
[Ernie Meunier]: Yes.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, I think it is something we want to start doing especially when we're doing locked long stretches or entire roadway where we are trying to incorporate that. So as you may have seen on South Street and then also on mystic out. We will have the green conflict zones, crossing each in section in winter street we hope to have that as well. Salem Street in the Haines Square piece fit yes and to be determined the rest of this, the Salem Street piece but yeah we hope to, we know that's a need and we want to add that wherever we can, whether we could add it later as well.
[SPEAKER_14]: If we just did the outside white lines. First, if we don't, we're not able to get it quick enough. We can come back and add the green.
[Ernie Meunier]: I mentioned it also because even on the South Street project, which I ride by in both kinds of vehicles, you know, the yellow skimpy markings for the cross flow are already fading.
[Todd Blake]: And just see- That was intentional, sorry. Oh. So Eversource was supposed to do it all correct last fall, but we ran out of weather that supports the better material. So thermal and epoxy need, to be done over 40, 45 degrees, and at night, it was no longer that temperature. So to buy us time, we had them paint a light coat of paint so that it would buy time till the spring so they'd come back and do it correctly. Oh, great. Okay, thank you. And that's on South Street? Yeah. Yeah, so yeah, even the mayor, I think, asked me, oh, I thought that was done. I was like, no, there's a lot more to do. It's like, it's the, It's a muted version of what it's supposed to be.
[Emily O'Brien]: That's great. That comes up a lot. Pat, what was your question?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, so actually, Ernie kind of asked it, and Todd and Amy answered most of it. But I was going to ask about on Salem Street, I know that we will have to resort to using sharrows, which is not always the preferable option. But that's what the space allows. If you have we considered using super showers on that and then more generally, what's your thinking of using those and also as a way of really kind of. It's a much stronger visual that helps define the space. And I think they are a lot more effective than just a regular shower. But I was kind of wondering if those are something that we're going to use and adopt, where and in what circumstances do you feel they would be best used?
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. I mean, it's definitely something we talk about. Todd and I have been using in various places, I do think. they are just more visible than a regular sharrow. Since they're still a bit new, and I think, if I remember correctly, still in the quote unquote experimental phase of MUTCD, there's not a ton of data on it yet, because people just haven't used them that much. And so as far as actual data showing that it makes things safer, it's still up in the air right now. I mean, obviously it is more noticeable, right? And just, you know, anecdotally like roads that I, some roads that I ride on very frequently, like going through Harvard on Oxford has them. And I do think it signals to people that that's just like a slow street. So yeah, I think that, you know, whether Salem is the right place for them, you know, I think we'd have to talk about that, but I do think that there's a tool that's gonna be a tool in our toolbox.
[Ernie Meunier]: We want to answer Todd's question that's in the chat thing about preference for Stripe spaces on which side of the bike lane?
[Todd Blake]: If I may just add to Amy's comment, and I had to double check myself Amy just now on our South Street plans, I believe we did spec doing the green back of the sheriffs in the lane that doesn't have the bike lane. Good. Oh, good. Okay. I didn't remember that either. Yeah, I double checked our notes on the bottom left corner to make sure.
[SPEAKER_09]: Okay.
[Todd Blake]: So in that particular job, that Mr. Gavin should have them. Cool.
[Emily O'Brien]: That's great. There was another thing that I remember from the traffic commission meeting was we were wondering whether there were also going to be bike may use full lane signs along the parts that don't have bike lanes or the side that doesn't have bike lanes. And if there's a way to enhance those, I think a lot of people either don't notice them or don't necessarily know what that actually means. And one suggestion is some places say bike may use full lane change lanes to pass, which is a little bit awkward when it's a two lane road and that means crossing the double yellow line. But if there isn't room for a bike lane, then that's because it's not possible to pass at a safe distance without crossing the double yellow line. And so there's maybe value in telling people to do that, obviously, when there's nobody coming the other direction. Another thought that I had about it was with pedestrian crossings, you'll see a sign that says, yield to pedestrians in crosswalk. And then there's like a yellow placard or a yellow border. And inside that yellow part, it says state law. And that indicates or reminds people that, hey, it's not just at this crosswalk where you're supposed to yield to pedestrians. It's actually a state law that says you're always supposed to yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. And so that, to me, is a little bit more of a strong statement that you're supposed to yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. And so I wonder if we have bike may use full lane signs, can we also just have a little yellow placard under them that says state law, which it is. And it's a little bit more eye catching and a little bit more of a strong statement that this is not like some special thing in this one special spot. And it's not a suggestion, it is the way that this system is theoretically actually supposed to work. So in the places that we can't have a separated bike lane, that might be a bit of a stronger statement about a more actionable way that people have to share the use of the travel lane. It's the reason why we kind of discourage the use of share the road signs because really nobody has any idea what that means. So that was another thought about that. Ernie?
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah, Amy, Todd, is there an international or otherwise graphic representation of that overly wordy only works with anglophiles sign? You know, bikes may use for what did it say? I've already, I've already driven past that. I remember seeing somewhere a graphic equivalent with an arrow and pictures of vehicles or something like that.
[SPEAKER_14]: There's there's one in Brookline on Beacon Street that I yeah, right every day. There's no standard for such a sign. It's not a standard. I've actually never seen that sign anywhere else. But they have them up and down Beacon Street in the places where there's not The bike lane kind of goes in and out on Beacon Street in Brookline in that part. Look, let's see what that says. Because even at 25 miles an hour you can't read all the... Yeah, I think it says all the words but it also has a little graphic with like... like a green bit in the middle, I don't know. I'll have to look and take a picture next time I can safely get out of traffic there.
[Ernie Meunier]: It's easy to visualize from the rear, a bicycle and a vehicle sharing a road together or something like that.
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah. Showing them single file, one after the other, not side by side.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: That's the hard part. Yeah.
[Emily O'Brien]: I mean, it's the side by side thing that everybody expects. And when we don't have room for a bike lane, we explicitly don't have room to do that.
[Ernie Meunier]: Right. So a hologram is needed.
[Todd Blake]: We took that to heart. Hopefully you all noticed, I went through street at South with that hybrid sign that shows the contraflow in the bikes. We took that to heart and did it side by side. Hopefully that came across. And the bicycles may use full lane. We're definitely open to using those. I mean, they're standard sign. We should use them wherever we can. So yeah, maybe Amy and I could get creative on what could be added to the top and bottom to reinforce it in some way. But the graphic idea that Ernie has, it could possibly be one too.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, maybe you can draw up another one, Todd. I do think that I'm really hesitant to do the must change lanes to pass thing, though, on Salem, just because it's only two lanes.
[Emily O'Brien]: It's not really changing lanes when you're crossing the center line.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, like you can cross the center line, but you probably shouldn't go all the way over there.
[Todd Blake]: I think I brought this up before here. New Hampshire has a really cool sign. on their roads, they have a law that says, you know, cars must pass bikes if it's 30 miles an hour, give them three feet, it's 44 feet if it's 50. yeah the graphical sign saying it it's kind of but um yeah we talked about this uh passing thing in the past before it's tricky because w the car is not supposed to even pass there and then it's supposed to be dash slash solid means you can pass in one direction not the other so how do you start to decipher for a bicycle it's okay but for to pass another car it's not and things like that yeah honestly like
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: if it's not safe to pass a car, it probably isn't really safe to pass a bike either. Like.
[Emily O'Brien]: Right. But we, I mean, we all like, and, and this is kind of everybody's complaint with riding in traffic in all of these places is that everybody thinks that passing is supposed to happen all the time. And there may not be room for it or people think they should be able to pass right this minute, even if there isn't actually enough space. And this is kind of the whole thing. It's like, just wait until there's actually room and then do it. And you won't be waiting forever. You won't be behind this bicyclist for the whole entire length of the street. You will have an opportunity. But you might not be able to do it right this second. And that is what this really comes down to in places where there's not room for a separate bike lane. That means there's not room for safe passing either without somebody leaving that lane. And it is just a question of how you tell people that that's what they're supposed to do. And this is everybody's problem.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: another idea could even, well, I realize this would be road-specific, but you could have the concept of passing zones explicitly called out, which is a weird one, but just going down that thought.
[Peter Calves]: Yeah, getting road-specific, I don't know if that'd be feasible in Salem Street. No, no, it wouldn't be.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, that's a good... Not in Salem. It sounds like a decent idea. Yeah, that's one that I've thought in my mind before too. And it's like, I picture, if you ever drive a vehicle on Southern Drive and they have like these pull-offs every once in a while for the breakdown vehicle versus a typical road that has a whole shoulder. It's like, you're gonna get, I always think like someone's gonna get lucky to break down right where that is or else they're pushing it to that spot. Next.
[Emily O'Brien]: Were there any other comments from the Traffic Commission meeting that we need to remember or review? Do we need to look at the plans now, or is that an option? Are those available?
[SPEAKER_14]: I have the one that we discussed at Traffic Commission pulled up, if you want to. Let me share or just share. Okay, sure.
[Ernie Meunier]: Let me that we talked about. Or is it the same one?
[SPEAKER_14]: We said it's the same one. Yeah, it's the same one. But there's I think some people in here that weren't necessarily at traffic commission.
[Denis MacDougall]: So do you also share?
[SPEAKER_14]: Okay, thank you.
[Emily O'Brien]: I guess we should also, just to clarify, the Traffic Commission approved the addition of the bike lanes with some tweaks and some expectations that some of the details may be not exactly as what's on this document, but the basic premise of having them was approved.
[SPEAKER_14]: So for those who weren't there, this is the area that we had been talking about before. And the bus stop here, zoom in a little bit. So it is a little bit tight, but what I actually attempted to do with the next version of this is squeeze everything down to like, I think I ended up doing, I remember if I did 10s or 10s and a 10 and a half foot lanes, and then a full eight foot bus stop and then a separate bike lane right here. It's all, it's minimal width or pretty close to it anyway. But I get what you, yeah, I get what you guys are saying. And I think that's a helpful feedback for this kind of style, particularly in this, when there's a merge right up ahead. So I hope that that, once I, once everything's, you know, I've addressed all the other comments and stuff, showing you guys the updated version. So I hope that that helps.
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah, that's great. Thank you.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Since now we've got it up here, I might also suggest, like, for continuity, having the section that's off to the left there coming out of off of Spring Street be also further to the left, like the 4.5 and the 6.5 there, just so it heads straight into where the bus stop will be. And you also get like, a little bit further from the curb in that crosswalk. More like having a bump out there for pedestrians, that sort of thing.
[Todd Blake]: Right. And everyone else. I know. Sorry, at the meeting. Bruce had a question, and then because we're showing the existing Haines Square right now and then this the proposed Haines Square project that four and a half, six and a half. is as of right now with the Haynes Square project it's likely less than that because the sidewalk's being bumped out.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Oh okay, the sidewalk is being bumped out as part of the Haynes Square project.
[Emily O'Brien]: Okay, right. So that's all the more reason to make sure that the bike lane stays kind of in that the left edge of the bike lane stays in the same orientation to the right edge of the travel lane throughout rather than, and if there's a little bit of extra space at the bump out, that tends to be a pinch point. So, then it doesn't have, and then again it would be in the right in this as, as we're looking at it, the bike lane ends up being on the right hand side of the bus stop and it would be on the left hand side, just so that it stays straight through.
[Todd Blake]: That makes a lot of sense. Just wanted to clarify. It's not a traditional bump out that most of us know of where it's just at the crosswalk. It's the entire length from where that bike symbol is near Amy's cursor all the way to the crosswalk. So it won't be one that juts out all of a sudden. It will be like part of the whole corner. So it will be slightly different. It won't be like, if someone was in that right, it wouldn't suddenly become a bump out. Yeah, it's hard to describe.
[SPEAKER_14]: about where the bike lane is right here. And the bike lane would be where the buffer is roughly.
[Todd Blake]: But it's a valid point by everyone. So yeah, we might as well. How short term this configuration will be, who knows, maybe a month or two and then it'll be the new stuff. So the Haines Square.
[Emily O'Brien]: And thank you guys for having that ready to present and get approved. And that's really exciting that that's happening. If there aren't other comments on that, our next item is master plan updates. I think Todd and Amy had wanted to ask about what we see our involvement as being. Um, and while we're on the topic of that, I think we can, um, I'd like to start with Todd and Amy talking about the, um, master plan, but then we should also talk about what other projects people want to focus on now that we have a bunch of new members. Um, we've talked about a bunch of things kind of like the neighbor ways project. Um, or adding signage in places that need it, that kind of thing. So I would really like to hear what kinds of things everyone here would like to spend their time and energy on. And then maybe if we can get a little bit of feedback from Todd and Amy about what they need from us and how best we can make some of those things happen. For example, if we have an idea for a neighbor way that we can put out with just signage that doesn't require dealing with any contraflow or anything else and it's just a question of signage, is this something where we just need to say here's what we want the signs to look like and here are all the spots that we need them to be? and hand it off, or is there something else that we need to do? So I guess the first thing is the master plan, but then I'd like to also move on and see what people have to say about other projects we'd like to think about.
[SPEAKER_14]: Did you want me to start with an update about the master plan?
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah, if you would. And if you have any questions for us or let us know how best we can be of help and how you would like us to be involved in that and so forth.
[SPEAKER_14]: Sure. So as I think some of you know, we do have an intern that's about to be starting with us next week, actually. And she is mostly going to be working with me and mostly going to be working on the master plan. Some things that I would like to do slightly differently from the last master plan is to take a lot more measurements in the field and just get more data, baseline data to begin with, and kind of do some preliminary engineering in order to make sure we know what fits at least, you know, just by standing on the street and looking at it. Obviously other things can come up during design when we get closer and we do survey and that kind of thing, but just to get a sense of like how much space there is out there, like what the curb radii are and stuff like that. So, and what some kind of challenges might be once we do get down to design, just to try to predict some of that stuff. But yeah, as far as guys helping out. I definitely want your help and I don't really have any specific way that I think you guys should help necessarily, so I'm open to suggestions. One thing that does come to mind though is just that I'd like to know what your routes are, just general routes. Obviously you don't have to go from door to door. It's personal information sometimes, I understand that, but There's, you know, there's definitely typical routes that I go to get to various parts of town and you know so I want to hear since you guys live there I want to hear what, where you guys go and what you try to avoid I guess too.
[Jenny Graham]: I have a question. This is Rebecca. So we had talked about the neighbor ways. project before and finding kind of different routes but I like the idea of doing something like that but having it tie into the master plan of possible things can be formalized so finding a way to kind of compile our own compile routes for kind of desire lines across Medford to assembly to Medford Square to West Medford and kind of find some of that I think a lot of people, you know, depending on where you bike, like you might be more familiar with one area of the city than the other, but somehow find a way to compile some kind of preferred routes or neighborhoods or kind of, you know, on the ground info that could be helpful for you guys to start, you know, thinking about stuff like that.
[Emily O'Brien]: Ernie?
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah, Amy and Todd, do we know on the commission what is happening this year with infrastructure, so we can get an idea of what your priorities are, where the money's going, what's shovel ready. As you know, I, in conversation in the fall, you guys said there's going to be a big push on Winthrop Street. And that may be projects like West Medford Square to Mystic Valley Parkway on Route 60 couldn't be accommodated this year, even though they seem like low-hanging fruit. So what's happening such that we know how to get involved and to prioritize in parallel with your needs and your plans?
[Todd Blake]: That's a good, good point early and Amy and I've talked about this like some of the, some of the things we're doing because we're trying to get it done as quickly as possible and build the infrastructure as quickly as possible. It may be a precursor to the master plan or concurrent with it right so. So, some of the ones that are more real than others, meaning that they're either already approved or there's already funding associated with them. is the South Street, full permanent country lane, the Mystic Ave piece that's been approved. So the bike lane from Main Street and Mystic to about Hancock Court, right so the one lane section of Mystic Ave, the Salem Street that was just approved. the main street to George Street to college out of quarter that we approved recently. So this is why we've been trying to get approval through traffic commissioner line things up so that we could actually start implementing some of these. Winthrop street is another one, Amy feel free to chime in. Winthrop street from basically from South all the way to Winchester line is what we wanna do. And that's based on the timing of all this. So South Mystic and Winthrop are based on Eversource has a commitment to restore those streets that they worked on. So then we have the opportunity to mark them after they're repaved. So South and Mystic, as you've seen, already been repaved, but Winthrop is yet to be repaved. So whether that's, you know, we don't know the exact timing on that, but we're trying to align all of that to be ready for that. So did I miss any, Amy?
[Emily O'Brien]: We do have Winthrop Street on the agenda a bit later. So if we can, we should certainly come back to that. One thing you mentioned, wanting to know where it is that people want to go, where the desire lines are. One thing that Jeff Buxbaum was the one who originally pointed this out, and I think it's a really good point, is In general, we kind of know where everybody wants to go because that's the big major roads that go in a straight line and have lots of cars on them. There's not really a big difference in where people want to go on bikes versus in cars. Medford is just not that big. You can ride across Medford pretty quickly in any direction. There's just not that much of it. I think it's one thing that I sometimes think about the Neighborways concept is I like the idea of providing more comfortable, easier, quieter safer routes for people to bypass those major streets. But I also think that we're short-sighted if that's the only thing we do. Because those major streets are also where the businesses are. There are a lot of destinations just along all of those streets. And those streets are the straight shot to get places. And they are still gonna be faster than meandering through neighborhoods. So I think while we you know, while we focus on the bypasses, we should also pay some attention to doing what we can to improve conditions on, you know, the straight shot. And we do really know where it is that people want to go. It's the big streets that have lots of cars on them, because those are the places that people want to go.
[Ernie Meunier]: Todd mentioned a few times in the presentation to the I was perked up by that and wondering if that is still sort of a priority, in that do we have a great resistance Um, I'm noticing that there's a lot of concern. By homeowners. To losing parking spaces in front of their houses compared to let's say five years ago. I mentioned it because, you know, my pet project here in West Medford would sacrifice 30 spaces, but they're not being used. So you can say on paper, oh, look at all the parking that we're not going to have. But since nobody parks there anyway, why not put a bike lane in and maybe nobody will complain. But the vibe, you know, your feet are on the ground in a different place. Do you still hear about the great hazards of sacrificing the vehicular parking from your end?
[Todd Blake]: That's a question for me? Yeah. Or Amy. I think that so that there is still some resistance. So, you know, so, so we're trying to get routes like, like we prioritize Medford Square, the new Green Line station, other routes, and whenever there's an opportunity that comes up, we're repaving, right? So the only true test so far has been that West Medford Safer School Project where we eliminate one whole side. And that was all residential. We haven't had a true test in Medford yet of a residential slash business area. So like a main street or a Salem street. So the reason that I specified the Salem no parking loss is we're trying to get the low hanging fruit first. And then as we go, once it's in and they see more bicyclists, the hope is that You know, then if you build it they will come and then people will start to realize, because right now, obviously they say nobody's using it it's not needed you heard some of the people at the traffic commission meeting. So, so, you know, we're doing both when you know, winter street. We're likely going to propose removing parking so it doesn't mean we're not going to it just means just like bus lanes, things like that, maybe a little more incremental approach. We're trying to get as much lane as many lanes out there as possible. that are, you know, that are, there's less friction about, or anticipated to be less friction. I did not anticipate the friction at Salem Street at all because of the no parking loss. And we still got, you know, feedback saying they didn't like it for whatever reason. So, and it's gonna be probably a case by case basis. Some of the residential neighborhoods that have low parking uses, you're pointing out, Amy's done a great job collecting a ton of parking data, and that's what helped push that High Street West Medford project over the edge. So like, some in that MassArt review were saying, why not bike lane in both directions? And then some of the community were saying, why not keep parking lanes in both sides? So the compromise was the one and one, right? The uphill and the... So that may be the way it shakes out. It's just, I don't have a crystal ball, but a lot of these residential neighborhoods, it may be, PB, David Ensign — Herndon, continuing. PB, David Ensign — Herndon, continuing. PB, David Ensign — Herndon, continuing. PB, David Ensign — Herndon, continuing.
[Emily O'Brien]: You know, just to move things along. Can we go to Peter and then Pat and then be Dan? I know you've been waiting for a little while.
[Peter Calves]: Yeah, sure. I was going to kind of only echo your point on the neighbor ways, which is what was happening when I raised my hand to say that while they will be helpful for some people who are looking for a safer route, a more comfortable route, and they're definitely a band-aid of sorts. The real problem is going to be that the destinations for people on bikes are the same as on cars. And if we want to have transportation equity and people on bikes being as comfortable moving around the city as people on cars, we're going to have to, at some point, reckon with that. And then, In terms of projects, in my particular corner of Medford, tying in the bike lanes on the Wellington Bridge and just the Wellington Bridge bike lanes, which were very nice when they got installed and are getting more and more full of sand and gunk and car parts as the days go on. And I know that's not, that's MassDOT and Somerville and not entirely within the city of Medford's control, but it's just something that affects me in my semi-daily life, so.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, Emily, should I respond or?
[Emily O'Brien]: Sure, go ahead.
[Todd Blake]: Just quickly on those Route 28 bridge, Route 28 bike lanes over the bridge. So it's still not complete, that grant, there's remaining work to get you off of the road and onto the path network on the Medford side. Some of those committed to doing that work with one of their contractors, but they have so many other projects going on that we're trying to get scheduled in the course of that. So there's still remaining work there to help folks. Where transitions from the bike lane into the Shero and the right turn lane into station landing, there's going to be a pull off into the grass there that you could go directly to the paths. It's just not done yet. In terms of maintenance, yeah, that is MassDOT in some Somerville, Some of them agreed to maintain some of the things like flex posts and things like that. I don't know who quite where it landed on who is going to street sweep there.
[Peter Calves]: Yeah, I just just something that my partner and I have noticed going back and forth the assembly that there's increasing amounts of sand and just debris in those lanes that make it a less than comfortable place to ride.
[Todd Blake]: So, if I may diverge for a second because it's related to this area. So there was recently a private development project being proposed at the old Pertucci's. I don't know if you all are aware of that. It's a several story laboratory building. So as part of that project, I submitted mitigation requests and told them to recommend it that the board, if it proves the project to require that the proponent at least prepare conceptual plans of a bike lane on Mystic Valley Parkway from Locust to Wellington, both sides.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Oh, wow.
[Todd Blake]: Because right now it's, as most of you know, it's signed as no parking, but yet it's painted as a shoulder, so nobody's using it at all.
[Peter Calves]: Yeah, nobody except for the occasional, well, the more than occasional police vehicle parked in front of the- The courthouse. The courthouse, yeah.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, so if that could become buffered bike lanes much like the ones DCR did on Fellsway, except in this case, there's no parking next to it, that would be great, right? So it would start to connect Locust to these Route 28 bike lanes and other things. It'll start to make all the necessary connections. So we do make comments like that at private developments to the planning board. So hopefully you all see that. And that's how the Locust Street bike lanes came about.
[Peter Calves]: Yeah. And I mean, I would say in that area, you have the, uh, McDonald park, the Shady's path on the South side, but that the, if the buffer bike lanes go through, that would be more convenient for accessing other parts of the network as the, the paths kind of had just have you just diving down into Summerville, whether or not you're going there.
[Todd Blake]: And this city has had subsequent meetings with DCR and MassDOT about the underpass that's going to mirror image the Somerville boardwalk. So that's also progressing, which will be a game changer as a lot of us know, right?
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: Yeah. That's the Clippership connector, correct?
[Peter Calves]: No. No, that's the Wellington Greenway. Clippership connector is the other side of that area.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, so this is just a Route 28 underpass project is what we refer to it as.
[Emily O'Brien]: Can we go to Pat?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. Yeah, I just like to, I was going to comment on the neighborhoods where people want to go, but like Route 16, I ride on it all the time. And that side is really important for people who are doing shopping and things. So like when I'm going home from the CVS or paint store or Aldi, I always ride there. So that'd be terrific. um but I think in terms of like where people go I think like the routes that are on the um the master plan are really you know those are that's a good indication of the places people want to go and um I can you know that sort of tells you where they want to go but there are two that I can tell you people do not want to ride on. One is Main Street. So like that section that like kind of between George and up to Sparks Park. And I think, like, there are a lot of kind of neighbor way alternate routes right have on. thing that kind of parallel Main Street. So I think that like would be the neighborhood concept would be helpful in that neighborhood. And also just like the pavement condition on Main Street is just it's been terrible for years and it it is really like quite dangerous to ride a bike on or a motorcycle or a car. And then the other one that like I hear a lot about is Riverside Ave and I think yeah the Clippership connector will provide an alternative to that and we have discussed plans plans for that previously so I think that that one does Riverside comes up a lot in conversations with people. That one I feel probably should be a priority.
[Emily O'Brien]: And I think it is also worth pointing out that Main Street has a lot of businesses that theoretically should be appealing to bicyclists passing by. And bicyclists will not stop at any of those places if they don't go down that street at all. So that is maybe something to keep in mind in a lot of these places. B. Dan?
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Yeah. So I'm happy to submit all of my routes. I'm not sure what the best way to do that, maybe Google Maps route instructions, that sort of thing.
[SPEAKER_14]: Just draw them on an aerial, take a little snap screenshot. Doesn't have to be anything crazy.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: The other thing is, I love the idea of taking more data. Something I brought up before, on occasion, is the idea of adopting standards that would make use of data, so that we can say, okay, if it's this wide, this is what we should do. all things being equal so that we're not having to debate every single street individually. And we can just say, OK, these are our standards for a street of this width and this level of traffic and that sort of thing. And there are a few sets of standards like that that other places use. I think we should not make our own street, just adopt one of those. But we should seriously try to adopt one of those existing sets of standards so that we don't have to think about it quite so hard for every individual street.
[Emily O'Brien]: I wonder, correct me if I'm wrong, but I sort of get the impression from the things that we've talked, from the specific places we've talked about, when it comes to the choice between like a buffered bike lane or just a regular bike lane or a separated facility, we're always so, so limited by the width of the street. we just don't really have enough choices for that to really come up.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: I mean, I agree with you. It's not that we just necessarily have choices, but every time we have to figure out what is the one thing that fits in here, And we're like talking about, okay, well, you know, can we do this thing given how wide this is? And every time we're talking about specific widths, whereas if we had a standard set of standards that said, this is what you can do in this width, you wouldn't have to talk about it every time. You say, this is what the standard says for this width.
[Emily O'Brien]: Todd or Amy, do you want to add to that or should we go on to the next?
[Todd Blake]: I just had a question. Sorry, go ahead.
[SPEAKER_14]: It is the idea of coming up with various standards is something that I've definitely been thinking about something I've done in the past at other places. But I do think it's a good idea. What exactly. what types of standards those are, whether that's like a prescription for a cross section for a type of street, or more just like what does a buffered bike lane look like, or a lot of other different things. I think we would have to think about a little bit. To Emily's point, like most of our roads are pretty narrow. So often we don't have a ton of options, unfortunately, but we do have options. And I think it would be helpful. Yeah, similar to like our bus stop conversation earlier, Salem Street, like I was using a BTD standard. If we can create some of our own standards for situations like that that happen all over the place, then I think that that would be really helpful. And, you know, then we can just plop them in. And obviously, there'll be other situations that, you know, arise that are that we don't have a standard for that are just kind of unique, you know, these things happen, but it's a starting place and I think yeah generally that's something that I would like to do for the city.
[Emily O'Brien]: So is that something that we should talk about putting together a working group to work with you on or is that something that's that's on the line or that's something that can be part of the master plan project.
[SPEAKER_14]: Possibly. I think possibly is the answer to all those questions. I think I was thinking about also it being maybe part of the master plan. I'm not 100% sure. We'd have to talk with Todd and try to figure that out. But I think it's an interesting idea. But I definitely would like to work with you guys on it, on creating it, for sure, and get your continuous feedback and stuff.
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah, maybe add that to the next meeting agenda as something that we want to figure out what our next steps are. Yeah.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, even something that came up at the Salem Street Traffic Commission, and this does relate to standards in the sense that some folks on the call I don't think they were meant for bicycle commission members but maybe they were. Some pointed out the state's policy about buffered bike lanes only, especially if it's speed or volume of such and such, right? But in Medford, we don't have a lot of that luxury. So it seemed like, I believe Medford Bicycle Advisory Commission is supportive of cases where we don't have room to do that, to do the bike lanes as we'll present, you know, shown in Salem Street. So, but there are some out there that think If you don't have the room to do the buffer, don't do them at all. So that could be even a basic standard. If you can't do buffer, do not do bike lanes at all or do not do shares at all, things like that. So even something basic like that is helpful because then we'll know not to spend time on Salem Street and spend time on roads that we could fit whatever you want as your standard or minimum.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Yeah. And just as a theoretical possibility for something like that, it might depend on the speed. Like, I wouldn't want to have an unbuffered bike lane on a 50 mile an hour road, but on a 20 mile an hour road, it's fine. There's a line somewhere.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, those are good things. I mean, Massachusetts DOT has their recommendations. But yeah, for Medford, most of it's 25 miles an hour or less, right, except I-93, Fells Way, and some parts of, yeah, so it's very limited number of roadways that are more than 25.
[Ernie Meunier]: I'm sensitive to be dance. Oh, I'm sorry. Sorry.
[Emily O'Brien]: Lisa was waiting for a while. Yes.
[SPEAKER_09]: Yes.
[Emily O'Brien]: I just want to keep things moving.
[SPEAKER_09]: Okay. So just briefly, because I feel like on the one hand, when you were saying at the beginnings, I don't know, 20 minutes ago, Emily, you know, let's talk about things, what our priorities are. I thought it was as the bike commission, but it seems like it's become a, What do we want Todd and Amy to focus on which might be the same thing. So, whatever but I mean, first of all Todd and Amy, just, I were all so appreciative of everything you do. I mean you're so fantastic. But, but going back to Rebecca's and just talking about a neighbor way and just kind of tying all this together that we've been talking about. I understand that bikers we want to go where traffic goes, but it's take it takes so long for every single one of these changes on major roads. to take place, you know, that Todd and Amy, you know, that have to drive with our input. So in the meantime, it just seems like for the bike commission, I think it would be great if we can, there are so many, and I'm not one of them, I have my own tiny little roots that I go around in Medford, but there's so many of you like B. Dan, Emily, Pat, almost every single one of you have found ways around Medford that a recreational cyclist doesn't even know about. So I feel like that's a service that we as a bike commission and would benefit me greatly to have more either signage or like you said at the beginning, Emily, on the Medford website that even talks to people about how you can get around Medford a little bit better.
[Emily O'Brien]: So I guess one regarding this signage thing for a Neighborways project, because this is something we've kicked around for a long time. If we just have, say, a working group that comes up with a specific route that says this is what this route is, and let's say it's something that doesn't involve like the Tufts parking lot, like the one that we were originally discussing, which has other complications. But let's say we have a route that doesn't involve any regulatory changes in any private property, anything like that. What process do we need to go through to put up signs so that somebody can follow that route? And is that just a question of having a working group make a Google map that has a line drawing in that route and then saying for each intersection and every place where we think it's important to point somebody to the next step on the route. You know, make a drop a pin that says this is what the sign needs to say, and this is where it needs to go, and then we And if we present that to Todd and Amy, is that the next step in making that happen? Or is there another procedure that we should go through? Just because we've talked about this as a project for a while, and I think we were not really sure what the next step in making it happen should be.
[Todd Blake]: What you just laid out is a good process, especially all the caveats you gave at the beginning. But I guess the question I would have is, and Amy, please jump in. So there's standard bike route signs, the green, that usually refer to like multi-use path type bicycle routes. So is there a suggestion maybe to Would it get confusing if we use the same type of bike route sign for neighborhoods or develop a separate guide sign that's slightly different in design so people can distinguish?
[Peter Calves]: I've definitely seen that standard bike route sign used. One of my biggest frustrations around here with the use of bike route signage is the city of Melrose has Main Street designated as the Melrose Bikeway and there's no facilities, they've just decided it's the Melrose Bikeway, but it's also Main Street.
[Emily O'Brien]: So Somerville has a sign for neighbor ways, and they have more information on them than that green bike route sign. I've mentioned before my frustration with those is that they have no information on them. And so if we call something, we we're using the term neighbor ways because that's what Somerville is using. And so there's a certain logic there that if we have a sign that looks just like theirs, that ties in with that larger network. And so there's, or Portland, Maine has kind of like bike route A, bike route B, and those are things you can follow from sign to sign and they go specific places and it's leading you you don't need a map, you can just say, oh, follow route A and you can go from sign to sign and it will take you to wherever route A goes. And that's kind of what we're talking about. So if we have probably the most easiest and most logical thing is to copy the Somerville Neighborways signs because that's what they're doing. And then we can put the appropriate information on them for each spot. Go ahead, Ernie.
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah, I just want to go back and comment on what BDAN was saying, because I, having had a career in standardization, internationally and in the US, I'm really sensitive to what he's addressing there. At the same time, this was brought up years ago, before some members were here. And Tim McGovern, who's now, you know, a lot of people's boss, suggested that, yeah, we can get involved in doing professional stuff there, study the ASH-2 standards and all the other guides, and become a traffic engineer yourself, and maybe you could be helpful to the pros. So I see, and I'm very grateful for Amy and Todd's work and their generosity in asking us to be partners therein, but I don't wanna for a minute think that any of us are going to try to develop the professional chops that would be I don't think it's. I don't think it's needed to be really helpful unless they really think that we can do things for them. I assume that they juggle multiple standards all the time. And all the regulations there in and come up with best fit patterns for our cow paths. And, and a limited option. and address things extremely linearly. So yeah, I think we're in a gray zone here. So I hope that we can be helpful to the pros. But, but understand that, you know, I for one, I'm not going to memorize an ash to manual, especially if it costs $500 to buy it.
[SPEAKER_14]: So it would be more of a feedback based type thing, we would bring you options and discuss how we might apply them and rules and that we are thinking of creating or policies we're thinking of creating. And, you know, you can help us determine how specific we want to get for certain situations. I definitely wouldn't ask you to draw up anything unless you wanted to.
[Ernie Meunier]: No, I was sensitive to Bidan's comment of not having to recreate the world or the wheel at every intersection. But it almost seems like in Medford, you almost have to. Because there aren't that many options available for that many different places that can be automatically applied.
[Todd Blake]: There are some overlapping efforts. There's some efforts going on for pedestrian wayfinding in the Medford Square area. So different things like that. at a corner, there could be a pedestrian sign, a bicycle sign, which I think they're all important. It's just working out how that all fits together. What I was asking about the shared screen I saw.
[Emily O'Brien]: I'm trying to figure out how to do that. It's not letting me.
[Todd Blake]: Sorry, I'm looking at a Somerville Neighborhood sign that's on their website, not on Street View. That's like a blue and light blue. Yeah. Yeah. It's not a bad sign. I wonder how legible it is from a distance type thing and how big they are, but it looks very nice and you'd be able to follow it. Yeah.
[Emily O'Brien]: I think that, you know, the thing about those is that it's a Even if you can't read everything on it from a distance, you can see that that sign is the thing you're looking for from a distance. And then if you need to, you can get close up and see it. If you're on a bike, that's not really a problem, but it is a distinctive thing that once you recognize that's the thing you're following, you can pick it out quickly. You'll see that sign and know that that's the thing that you're looking for. and it will have on it the information that you need. But a lot of bike route signage just doesn't have anything specific at all. And it's better to have, or it says, I saw a sign in Cambridge pointing down Magazine Street to the BU Bridge. But then when you go down Magazine Street, there's not a single other sign anywhere pointing to the BU Bridge. And you get to the end of Magazine Street, and there still is not a sign. And of course, I know how to get to the BU Bridge. But if I didn't know how to get there from one end of Magazine Street, I probably don't know how to get there from the other end of Magazine Street either. And so there is one sign, but there isn't the rest of the signs that gets you the rest of the way. Yeah.
[Jenny Graham]: I bike through both Cambridge and Somerville kind of their equivalent of neighbor waves each day. And there's one in Cambridge where they actually, they don't have, they have very simple signs that just say Inland Square and you go through these zigzag side streets. And that first, the first time I went in, it was actually very easy to follow. In Somerville, I don't think I've ever seen any of their neighbor wave signs. And I think it was only by accident I found out about a few good routes on. just looking on Google after years of going roundabout ways. So I feel like we could kind of take the best of each, but we wanna make sure that someone who's kind of new to the streets could maybe follow the breadcrumbs without having to get out their phone and look at Google and every block and try and figure out which way they're gonna go, because that's very slow and intimidating.
[Emily O'Brien]: And the whole point of having this route is that you don't have to do that.
[Jenny Graham]: Yeah.
[Emily O'Brien]: Peter?
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: You're muted.
[Peter Calves]: I was going to agree with what Ernie was saying. It's like having also done slash doing traffic engineering professionally, there is an alphabet soup of standards. So it's definitely going to be easier from a from a layman's side to just like have options and then discuss among options rather than trying to navigate the astros and nactos of the world.
[Emily O'Brien]: Um, so we should move on to, um, Winthrop Street is the most pressing thing on the list. Um, we have to make sure we get to the, um, bike lights and upcoming events. Um, I'm going to propose that we, um, If we all have routes that we like, like side street routes, you can use Google Maps to make a route and share them with the group on the email list. And then for the next meeting, we can compile those and see if there's something we want to really focus on putting together. And that would be a project that we could look at. There seems to be a lot of interest in that. And since we have Todd and Amy here, we should talk about Winthrop Street.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, just one more thing to add on to the submitting the routes idea. If you can think about intersections too, like we want to do intersection improvements, like certain intersections that are maybe difficult to get through on a bike, like maybe there's a bike leading up to it, maybe there isn't, but for various reasons it's hard to make a left or whatever the situation is. Think about those situations and and let me know what they are as well. That would be really helpful.
[Emily O'Brien]: This could be a good thing to ask on the social medias.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, good call. Todd.
[Todd Blake]: I just had another quick update that's relative to bicycling, but it doesn't necessarily always get the same press as bike lanes. A while back, I went out with Bruce to check on roadway loops, whether they could sense a bicyclist or not, on Harvard Ave at Boston Ave. So, and there were certain spots that could and certain spots that couldn't. So the city, Amy and I, good work Amy. applied for a bottleneck grant from MassDOT and we received it. So that grant involves putting video detection on all the bus nabs, signalizing sections, and video detection will be much better at sensing cyclists than the old roadway loops. And we won't have to worry about utility companies digging them up. So eventually, it's happening this summer. All the intersections besides Winthrop Street will have them. And then once we rebuild Winthrop Street at Boston Ave entirely, that will have it as well. So just a little side note, because we don't get to talk about all this stuff usually.
[Emily O'Brien]: Do those still work in the dark?
[Todd Blake]: The technology is getting better and better. It used to have problems with snow and birds and things like that. But it's supposedly all good now. So it's MassDOT-approved equipment, so I'm confident.
[Daniel Nuzzo-Mueller]: One thing I'd like to point out about those is there's an intersection out in Lexington that uses that technology, and the cameras are not aimed at the location where they request that bike stop. It's actually aimed 20 feet behind that. So if you roll up and wait on the bike symbol behind the stop line, it will never detect you. Geez, but this is Merritt Road out in Lexington. So I just want to throw out that If they use that tech, they should be pretty sure to have some sort of painting on the ground where cyclists can expect to wait and they will be within view because it's a very frustrating experience to have it aimed at a location other than that.
[Todd Blake]: That's a great point. We can work with you to troubleshoot that too after they're in. These ones are even the next tech where it's just one video camera for the entire section. So the original ones had one per approach and it's directed. These new ones are one per in section. It sees everything all at once. So, but it's still gonna have a detection zone, like you're saying, Daniel. So, but you know, for Medford, a lot of our locations didn't have any sensors at all. So no matter where you were stopping, So hopefully this is better.
[Emily O'Brien]: Should we go on to Winthrop Street?
[SPEAKER_14]: Todd, do you want to start on that one?
[Todd Blake]: Sure. So Winthrop Street. The plan is again to have bicycle infrastructure from South Street all the way to the Winchester line. So in, for the most part, Amy, correct me if I'm wrong, that includes a bike lane on each side of the street. I don't think there are any segments that would have, if there are, there'd be a very short segment of just a share, but the plan is to have bike lane each direction, whether that's buffered or not, it depends on the option. that goes forward if we remove all parking with the exception of, you know, certain blocks that have indents for them, then we'd be able to do buffered everywhere but if we only remove, say one side then it might be more like the five to six foot bike lane each side, but the idea is to get you all the way from South Street to Winchester line. So, it did already exist from the high school nor. They just weren't painted very well the last few years and then Eversource has been out there for four years. It's challenging but so yeah Eversource got to complete their work, and then they're on the hook to restore curb to curb so they're going to repave just like they did sell in Winthrop. So the repaving for Winthrop Street. is not all the way from South it's from route 16 so the one block between 16 and South is not going to be repaid as part of what ever source, or from 16, all the way up to the Winchester line it will eventually be repaid schedule wise is just to be determined, because as most people know they're still doing work in some areas in that they finish the bulk of the work in other areas with temporary patches right so So that's in terms of, yeah, in terms of priority, we need to give Eversource a restoration plan whenever that restoration is going to occur. And also we hope to meet with the community about it as well, so.
[SPEAKER_13]: So question on the Winthrop Street stuff. How is that interacting with the new development that's going in next to the high school?
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, depending on the timing of it, either they have to match us or, you know, basically, yeah, it's a good point. So any project South Street we're dealing with that. If the bike lanes are already there, that will become the new existing conditions and they have to, you know, work around that or vice versa. There's a crosswalk going in with that new development that's not there right now. It just depends on whoever goes in last will have to accommodate it and whatever's there at that moment will be the new existing conditions so.
[SPEAKER_13]: yeah it's it's mostly you know just thinking about you know go through do all the work and then if they're still you know running their heavy equipment they're going to just trash it all.
[Todd Blake]: Yeah, we hope that's not the case. But there's a monitoring when when a street gets paved for five years, you have to do more than the standard trench, you have to do much larger areas. So that avoids the deterioration of the pavement so soon after doing it.
[Emily O'Brien]: So Matt, show your hand up.
[phPK_rgTxTg_SPEAKER_06]: One thing I wanted to flag on the Winthrop Street, and this kind of goes back to what Ernie brought up earlier about parking. You wouldn't really think a lot of people park on Winthrop Street, but the American Legion sometimes has the events, and then the road is just like flooded. And I could imagine them being vehemently opposed to, and some of the neighbors perhaps too. There's more parking on the lower part of Winthrop than you might anticipate. So obviously Todd and Amy can't, have a crystal ball, like you said. But we don't, I don't think we want to be in a situation like Cambridge, where, you know, you have just cast on, I think, share the article, you know, just like all they feel people feel like this is sprung upon them, and you know, you're stealing their parking. And so it might help just to talk to the Legion in advance. That's the main, I live in that area. That's the main parking issue I see there. Otherwise, I wouldn't expect a lot of pushback, but you never know.
[SPEAKER_14]: Good point. We've been collecting a bunch of parking data at various times. Some strategic, some of those have been strategic times, like over by Victory Park, when there's like little league games and stuff like that. And also Memorial Park, I think it's called, over on the South edge of the project. So that way we have the data to, you know, when people say, oh, what about the baseball games? We're like, oh, here you go. Here's our parking data. So we can certainly collect some parking data around there as well.
[phPK_rgTxTg_SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, because I'm not sure if that would really come up in your data. I hope it would, because it's like maybe once or twice a month. For the most part, it doesn't seem like a problem, but they must have events every once in a while, then it's just a ton of parking. Yeah, I mean, they have space for their own. I mean, they have some law, maybe they need to expand their private law. But I don't know.
[Todd Blake]: Thank you for flagging that because as Amy just said, we've tried to be strategic to capture those events so that we could say, oh, we looked at that. So we'll have to peruse their calendar to see when their next event is.
[SPEAKER_14]: And I do have, sorry, I do have two versions of the plan so far. That can be one that's like taking away almost all of the parking, except for over near Victory Park. I believe in maybe one other little spot and one that's preserving a lot of it, but also not all of it. And so we can certainly like, you know, mix and match pieces as we need to, depending on what the data tells us and what the public, you know, hates or whatever.
[Emily O'Brien]: I think since this is also going by the high school, I think this would be a great opportunity to involve The high school students who either bike to school now or are interested in biking to school one you know we've I think we've tossed around a little bit before everybody has their own ideas about whether you like or don't like various types of buffered. One concern that I have with some of the types of buffered bike lanes that you see around the area is that the bike lane gets plowed by its special plow and the road gets plowed and the area in between with the bollards collects a mountain of snow and then there's also a mountain of snow on the edge of the sidewalk. So then it melts and it runs across the bike lane because of the crown of the road and then there's a sheet of ice across the bike lane and that condition will last for a pretty long time and it kind of comes back every morning. And that keeps going for a long time after the rest of the roads everywhere else are completely dry. And so that means that if you're looking out your window of your house to see is the road conditions good enough to bike to school today, it might look like it's perfectly good. And in most places it's perfectly good. And then you get to the one spot where you have this nice buffered bike lane and it's either it's a sheet of ice or it has intermittent ice. And that's most likely to be a problem in the morning when kids are going to school. And that's and I think that's something that we just want to keep in mind again, because we want this to be safe for kids to use on the way to school. And it's the kind of thing that you won't be able to tell necessarily just by looking out at what the condition of your own street is, because it's kind of a very specific. It's very specific to certain certain types of buffered bike lanes and. I think there are probably ways to avoid it and if we end up with a buffered bike lane there are some types of them that are more prone to this problem than others but it's something that we should just keep in mind in that in as a consideration for a lot of the year it's not a problem but then it could actually be a problem for a big chunk of the year. and it could make those bike lanes unusable at times when the rest of the road is otherwise in perfectly good shape. So whatever we do, I think we need to make sure that that's taken into account too.
[Todd Blake]: Emily, that would be valuable information for us because maintenance-wise it's a challenge to do any of this sometimes, right? So knowing if you all felt strongly about that and you thought it was better just to have a painted buffer versus painted with FlexPost because of the reason you just described, then we would know to, you know, focus our efforts on things other than the FlexPost for the Buffer Pike Link.
[Emily O'Brien]: And that may be something that we need input from parents and students, too. If this is, you know, of all places, this really, this is something we really need to hear from those people, I think.
[Jenny Graham]: Yeah, I agree with that, though. I think that the majority of the year flux posts and a buffered bike lane will help. And my experience in other biking and other buffered bike lanes, even in the kind of the best conditions where they've plowed and everything, there is that ice issue. But at the same time, it rarely lasts more than, you know, a certain period of time. And I still think that it is valuable to have that the flux posts and buffers when possible, especially for a school. So even if there's, you know, a couple days after a storm, it takes to get cleared and, you know, people can't bike still, there's still like 360 days, they could use it or 350, it only takes out a couple days of, you know, bad weather. So I think I support protected bike lanes whenever possible.
[phPK_rgTxTg_SPEAKER_06]: I asked what the plan is for the the Rotary high street and went through. Do you have that going to be nice like powder house or probably something less of a build than that.
[Todd Blake]: At this time, it will probably be more like a traditional markings to a traditional circle around the boat. I don't know if we have the same amount of room they had in Paros. Paros had a lot of extra pavement. Sure. But yeah, it would be nice to have some sort of hybrid getting closer to that. Yeah, Amy and I will keep looking at it. It's a tough spot. I can't imagine. Yeah, I don't really know.
[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I do have some. Currently it's just a shared condition for bikes going through that roundabout, but I do have some additional kind of tightening up and closing off of slip lanes that I'm proposing as well, that I think will help keep the cars going in one direction, not flying all over the place, which is what I think makes that particularly dangerous.
[Emily O'Brien]: Um, if this, I think it sounds like we're up to date on Winthrop street as it currently stands. Um, is there other, is there anything else on this topic before we go on? In that case, we have upcoming events and the Bike Lights for Kids project. Those are kind of, those two things kind of tie together. Ernie, do you want to give an update on the Bike Lights for Kids?
[Ernie Meunier]: Sure. I'm not muted. Okay. Yeah, I sent some information in the interim, just so as to not take so much time in our busy schedule of the 240 lights kits that arrived whenever it was a few weeks ago, I've distributed 200 of them. And have about I'll have a good three dozen or so for our June 3 rodeo at Tufts Park. There should be I think, the second batch of 240 left Singapore around May 10th and take a month to get here. So they're not going to arrive certainly by next week. I have everything needed for that, supplies for that shipment, except for the League of Cyclists bike guide. So in the interest of time, I'll order 250 of those on my own pay for them. So as to get them in time for distribution, my hope. in talking to the various vice and principals of the schools is to visit them again before June 23rd and give them what they think is a reasonable supply to distribute at recess or little events or talks I present there or whatever to be able to feed some of the population for the summer. So I'm hoping that there'll be a big distribution of the second lot shipment of them in mid June. I may have secured a sponsor for a third shipment for September already, but I'm hasn't committed to it yet. But that's really helpful. Oh, just as an aside. Oh, yeah. So Pat, did you want to talk about June 3? And I was just thinking that if we are going to do that, would it be that we're going to have that event? Could we have a big map there and try to combine some tasks by asking parents who show up what they think are hot spots in the city that we might prioritize their work on and let them mark up a map. And we'll provide that to Todd and Amy as well as our own comments.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I think that's a good idea because that will be a good opportunity to engage grownups. I think like something more formal, I'd be hesitant to like add that aspect to it since we've got a lot going on already, but we can You certainly want to bring this with us and have it on display.
[Ernie Meunier]: A map and some magic markers and ask parents to, I don't know, mark where they live, where they like to cycle, where they see a problem intersections, you know, just.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, I think what I would do is keep more of a like a conversation rather than having them like write something out. I think that's going to be hard to manage.
[Ernie Meunier]: Just have them mark one map that you have a large map We have a large map posted on a table next to the helmets and lights and all that. Yeah.
[SPEAKER_06]: But that's, I think logistically, I think that's going to be difficult, like, like producing a large map and even like the space for it, like directing that. But I think, I think like engaging people and asking would be really good.
[Ernie Meunier]: Someone asked, I posted before this photo of this darling kid, Clementine, all well suited up with the first lights kit on her bike. And again, her parent who is, you know, she's a student, I think at the Roberts here, parent gave us full permission to use that on the city websites or any promotional materials on our behalf. but I'm not gonna take the lead on that. I don't know where that photo is, but one of you must have it in their archives. So I'm gonna take on the task somehow of visiting all the schools between the time these lights come in and their end of season on June 23rd and see what I can do for light distribution through the public schools. That will of course inform how quickly I go through that. 240 sets of lights and how quickly I'll want to gear up again for a September, October distribution for the rest of the year, for the season. But these are turning out to be sort of wildly popular, you know, and I try to carry two kits with me daily when I ride around because I'll run into somebody. or a bunch of kids and give away one or two, and then the other two will argue about why they don't have any. And I have to bike home and get two more and go back, et cetera. And we have discussions about blinking and dinosaurs and all that. And it's really kind of been a lot of fun as well. So I'm glad I'm doing this because I think it's working out pretty well. So that's it. I'll order bike guides. I already have the other literature, except for the Medford Bicycling stickers, which Pat and I discussed briefly. And I don't know if, Pat, you think that we're going to get those, if we're going to tweak the design or not, whether that can be be done and get another few hundred of those printed within the next few weeks. It's a kind of a nice thing to kids to be able to put on the bike and identify that they are a cyclist in Medford and also that the kid is provided by us in Medford and for distribution, you know, to us. It's a civic pride thing for protecting the kids. And the last question is, that I have, our topic is related to what Bruce made up last time. How do I contact adults in need of lesser means who might take advantage of this program? I've used the K in the acronym to mean kits, bike light kits. And now I've heard two people say bike lights for kids, which I think is pretty cool. But I don't know if we want to limit it just to that. distribution or just initially?
[Emily O'Brien]: I think getting to adults is great. And adults are more likely to be riding at night in the dark than kids because kids have bedtimes in the summer.
[Ernie Meunier]: But how do I do that? Who can I talk to who has something to do with housing or populations in need in Medford where that, you know, I don't know where to start with contacts there. I'm not that civically linked. So if you guys have any ideas on how to talk to people in those populations, I will bless you. I will try to pursue that during the summer.
[phPK_rgTxTg_SPEAKER_06]: There's a food kitchen at the Universalist Church on High Street. I think it's last Thursday of every month. That might be a way.
[Ernie Meunier]: And there are people who might bike there as an example.
[Emily O'Brien]: I also wonder if there's a way to get in touch with food service workers at restaurants who often are going home late at night and often are going home at times when the buses are not running that frequently. I think any place we can find a lot of adults who might be riding around at night or might be interested in riding around at night. Honestly, I don't even care if they have the means to buy their own bike lights, but if we can hand them this kit that has lights and some safety information and some information about biking in Medford and that encourages them to bike somewhere. so much, I don't really care who they are, if that, if that gets them out.
[Ernie Meunier]: Yeah, even like, even though there's only four bucks a kid and half of it's, we have co sponsors for only costing us to give, I've been very strict about limiting it to residents, kids of Medford, and maybe their parents, which I maybe shouldn't have had because there have been kids around who are clearly in need, and they live in Arlington or Somerville, and I say, Oh, sorry,
[Emily O'Brien]: Well, also somebody who's biking, somebody, you don't have to live in Medford to bike in Medford and we care about anybody who's biking in Medford.
[SPEAKER_09]: Yeah. Okay. I thought last month we talked about the Medford Housing Authority and them wanting some bike share stations. So I don't know who the head of the Medford Housing Authority is, but that might be another avenue.
[Ernie Meunier]: But they are known as the Medford Housing Authority? I believe so, yeah. All right, I'll start by digging there.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, Ernie, talk to Kevin was going to provide us some contact information. Maybe when we do the helmet distribution, he'll be there. There'll be an opportunity to talk to him about it.
[Ernie Meunier]: Oh, Kevin Krause?
[SPEAKER_06]: No, Kevin at the rec center.
[Ernie Meunier]: Oh, oh, I see. Yeah, just as a word then, 10 seconds. I've heard no word about the bike kitchen at the high school. Apparently has not gotten developed for whatever reason. It's probably on hiatus till the fall.
[Emily O'Brien]: They're still working on it. And I dropped off a repair stand for them, which they- Oh yeah, they were asking about that.
[Ernie Meunier]: You were able to help them with that? Oh, good. Very cool. All right, I think that's it for me. Thank you.
[Emily O'Brien]: Pat, other events?
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, so we got two other events coming up. The next one's coming up soon. It's the June 3rd, Friday evening, 5 to 7 o'clock at Tufts Park in South Medford. We'll be doing the helmet distribution. This is one of the helmets from our Benefactor Project Kidsafe, Breakstone Glockenpoint, the law firm provides these. We did this last year. I've got three cartons of them, so about six dozen helmets in my dining room, plus there are a few left over from last year. And we will, I think, Ernie, since you confirmed that we do have bike light kits, we can use those as a prize for the do-it-yourself bike rodeo. The Tufts Park features a half mile loop around the park. And we did this last year. We set up like a course and I have like a bunch of like signs to put up out on it. And then all sorts, I got my collection of fake rocks and tennis balls and a bunch of other things that we can put out, chalk out like crosswalks and things like that. So that was very successful last year. And then we have a bingo card where kids can check off all the different things that they've done on the course or demonstrate knowledge about traffic rules, things like that. And then they will get a prize, which I think the bike light kit would be perfect. And that's pretty much it. I will share out more in all the details on the email list. I know we already had a few people who volunteered to help out. I think, Ernie, you were in on it. And who else?
[Ernie Meunier]: We should have a good four people there.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
[Ernie Meunier]: And the filling of the helmets. And I'm going to want to adjust brakes and maybe bring a pump for air and raise saddles and all that. So we could use four or five people if the weather's nice.
[SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, and I think we'll have a couple people from the rec center too. So that's probably five of us already. But if anybody else who wants to help out, get in touch with me. Or you can even just show up on that Friday evening.
[Ernie Meunier]: And there'll be plenty to do. I'm sorry, five o'clock or seven o'clock.
[SPEAKER_06]: From from five to seven. Yeah, we found that was good. That's what we did last year. And we found those a good time because didn't conflict with a lot of the like, ballgames and stuff like that. Parks not been heavily used to that time. And it was, yeah, it's good time for like, for parents with younger kids to be free and get over there. So that's the plan.
[Ernie Meunier]: Do you need more landscape marking stuff? I happened to be at Dick's and saw that they sell these little Dayglo colored plastic one inch tall cone discs that I guess are used for marking boundaries and ball fields and soccer fields and all that.
[SPEAKER_06]: Oh, yeah, absolutely. The rec center has some of those. All right. So yeah, I've got I've got like a half a mile of tennis balls, too. So I think we're I think we're good on that. That's good to know about.
[Emily O'Brien]: Yeah.
[SPEAKER_06]: Um, any other questions about that?
[Emily O'Brien]: Sounds good.
[SPEAKER_06]: Okay, then the other one that's coming up in end of July, the Medford Farmers Market does a bike fest. And I think what we're going to do is that's July, Thursday, July 28. That'll be three to seven o'clock. And that's more of a tabling thing, although we could do more if we had an activity. But I think what we're gonna do is partner up with Walk Medford and Bike to the Sea, which is the organization that got the Northern Strand Trail up through Everett up to Lynn done. And the kind of theme that we've been talking about is like how to get places. So it actually works very much into what we've been talking about tonight is like, you know, how to show maybe showing people like how to get from the farmers market to Wellington Circle or to Arlington Center. And I think like one thing that we could do is maybe if anybody has like kind of unusual bikes that they might want to bring like an e-bike or a cargo bike or a classic bike, that could be a kind of fun thing to like demonstrate some of the things that you can do to different kinds of bikes and really focus on them. Yeah, we'll bring it along. Yeah, so that one's a couple months out. So we have time to plan that, but just wanted to get people starting to think about that one. So that's my report.
[Emily O'Brien]: Great. We're coming up on nine o'clock, coming up pretty soon. Really quick, there is this MassDOT capital investment plan that has a public comment period. There aren't a lot of projects on it in Medford, but there are a couple. I would encourage people to go to that website, which I'm just putting into the chat right now. And you can see what is in there and make comments. So we should all go there and check that out. Regarding working groups for some of the things that we talked about. I am interested in dealing with some of the signage shortfalls that we've discussed. I think this is something we can have a couple of people sit down and hammer out, or we can have a couple of us, or anybody who's interested, really plot out useful routes that we know using Google Maps. You can create, under my locations, you can create a map And then we can look at those and see what we need to do to follow through on getting some of these things laid out and with signage and so forth. If we wanted to create a new, our own alternative to the Neighborways sign, for example, that might be something. I know we have a number of graphically expert people here. So that would be something that some of those people could discuss making what a sign like that might look like. So those are some things that we should make sure that we follow through on. And we can talk about that more in the next meeting. I think some of these we can put together ad hoc working groups in the meantime. And I would say the best thing to do is say to the email list, I'm looking for two to three people to help me put together this specific thing. Two or three people can meet and hammer out one of these things and then bring it to the next meeting. So I think that's a good way to proceed with that. We can't have too many people working on the same project in the same room at the same time, because then we end up, if too many people are working on the same thing, then we get close to quorum and that's a problem. But if we're talking about putting a lot of little roots together, we can start working on a network like that. And I think we can coordinate that over the email list. So I would encourage us all to do that as well. Does anybody have anything else? Matt is asking, can I be added to the email list? There's an email list for commission members. I don't think we have a separate email list in addition. Is that correct?
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, we don't. Yeah, we like pretty much all of our non commission like just. bookkeeping communication is through social media like the Facebook page.
[Emily O'Brien]: But I would say, Matt, you can email me and I'll type my email address in here. And if you're interested in helping out with any of these things, email me and let me know and I'll connect you We definitely want the input, and we definitely want the help. And Peter, email me also, and I'll make sure that you get added to the email list if you're not on there already. And I'm typing my email address into the chat. Anything else? Do we have a motion to adjourn?
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: So motion. Second.
[Emily O'Brien]: All in favor.
[nqVIJ3wsDWg_SPEAKER_13]: Aye. Aye. Aye.
[Emily O'Brien]: Meeting is adjourned. Thanks, everybody.
[Ernie Meunier]: Thank you. Thanks, guys. Thank you. Great first meeting, Emily.
[Emily O'Brien]: Have a good night.
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